What are you reading?

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Admiral Piett
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Re: What are you reading?

Postby Admiral Piett » Sun 2 Jul 2017 22:09

Grabbed_by_the_Spets wrote:Snip.


An update on the Chiang Kai-shek bio. It is superb. I also looked into the wider literature, and it is considered the standard Chiang Kai-shek biography in English. I have gotten as far as Stilwell's almost improbably incompetent performance in Burma in 1942. Taylor adds more detail to the other new histories I have read of the campaign. In all my years of historical study, I have never seen the old historiography misrepresent events in such an inaccurate fashion. After his idiotic counteroffensive imploded, as the British and Chinese warned him it would, Stilwell literally abandoned his entire 100k-strong field command while they were still fighting as cohesive formations, and fled into India. Over the years of entirely uncritical histories, that shit-show somehow morphed into a "glorious chapter in American military history," when what it should have turned into was a Stilwell court marshal.

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Re: What are you reading?

Postby Vulcan 607 » Sun 2 Jul 2017 22:21

Admiral Piett wrote:
Grabbed_by_the_Spets wrote:Snip.


An update on the Chiang Kai-shek bio. It is superb. I also looked into the wider literature, and it is considered the standard Chiang Kai-shek biography in English. I have gotten as far as Stilwell's almost improbably incompetent performance in Burma in 1942. Taylor adds more detail to the other new histories I have read of the campaign. In all my years of historical study, I have never seen the old historiography misrepresent events in such an inaccurate fashion. After his idiotic counteroffensive imploded, as the British and Chinese warned him it would, Stilwell literally abandoned his entire 100k-strong field command while they were still fighting as cohesive formations, and fled into India. Over the years of entirely uncritical histories, that shit-show somehow morphed into a "glorious chapter in American military history," when what it should have turned into was a Stilwell court marshal.


Same goes for Orde Wingate the man was mad he trusted only one man and took orders from his mother over his commanders (why he was ordered out of Israel). In forgotten voices of Burma some men hated him he ordered the units to disperse despite the fact the columns were well armed making it easier for the Japanese to hunt them down. One officer in a field hospital got congratulated by Wingate on making it out, all he wanted to say was no thanks to you.

If you want more personal books on the war in Asia try jungle soldier and forgotten voices of Burma excellent reads.

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Re: What are you reading?

Postby Admiral Piett » Sun 2 Jul 2017 22:26

Vulcan 607 wrote:Same goes for Orde Wingate the man was mad he trusted only one man and took orders from his mother over his commanders (why he was ordered out of Israel). In forgotten voices of Burma some men hated him he ordered the units to disperse despite the fact the columns were well armed making it easier for the Japanese to hunt them down. One officer in a field hospital got congratulated by Wingate on making it out, all he wanted to say was no thanks to you.

If you want more personal books on the war in Asia try jungle soldier and forgotten voices of Burma excellent reads.


Interesting! Yeah, once I finish up on my China theatre reading, I may move into my Burma stuff.

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Re: What are you reading?

Postby Vulcan 607 » Mon 3 Jul 2017 10:43

Admiral Piett wrote:
Vulcan 607 wrote:Same goes for Orde Wingate the man was mad he trusted only one man and took orders from his mother over his commanders (why he was ordered out of Israel). In forgotten voices of Burma some men hated him he ordered the units to disperse despite the fact the columns were well armed making it easier for the Japanese to hunt them down. One officer in a field hospital got congratulated by Wingate on making it out, all he wanted to say was no thanks to you.

If you want more personal books on the war in Asia try jungle soldier and forgotten voices of Burma excellent reads.


Interesting! Yeah, once I finish up on my China theatre reading, I may move into my Burma stuff.


The forgotten voices is excellent even mentions a bit were some troops got close air support from some transports throwing grenades out of the plane!

https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Books/Jungle ... 1849160767

Oh I also forgot the brave Japanese by an Australian POW

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Brave-Japanese ... e+japanese

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Re: What are you reading?

Postby Admiral Piett » Mon 3 Jul 2017 16:03

Vulcan 607 wrote:The forgotten voices is excellent even mentions a bit were some troops got close air support from some transports throwing grenades out of the plane!

https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Books/Jungle ... 1849160767

Oh I also forgot the brave Japanese by an Australian POW

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Brave-Japanese ... e+japanese


Thanks!

This is a book containing various individual soldiers accounts from the Malaya & Singapore campaign, but from the Japanese side.

https://www.amazon.ca/Guns-February-Ord ... 9971692732

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Re: What are you reading?

Postby Vulcan 607 » Mon 3 Jul 2017 18:18

Admiral Piett wrote:
Vulcan 607 wrote:The forgotten voices is excellent even mentions a bit were some troops got close air support from some transports throwing grenades out of the plane!

https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Books/Jungle ... 1849160767

Oh I also forgot the brave Japanese by an Australian POW

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Brave-Japanese ... e+japanese


Thanks!

This is a book containing various individual soldiers accounts from the Malaya & Singapore campaign, but from the Japanese side.

https://www.amazon.ca/Guns-February-Ord ... 9971692732


Thank you! Can never have to many books!

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Re: What are you reading?

Postby Grabbed_by_the_Spets » Tue 4 Jul 2017 02:30

Admiral Piett wrote:An update on the Chiang Kai-shek bio. It is superb. I also looked into the wider literature, and it is considered the standard Chiang Kai-shek biography in English. I have gotten as far as Stilwell's almost improbably incompetent performance in Burma in 1942. Taylor adds more detail to the other new histories I have read of the campaign. In all my years of historical study, I have never seen the old historiography misrepresent events in such an inaccurate fashion. After his idiotic counteroffensive imploded, as the British and Chinese warned him it would, Stilwell literally abandoned his entire 100k-strong field command while they were still fighting as cohesive formations, and fled into India. Over the years of entirely uncritical histories, that shit-show somehow morphed into a "glorious chapter in American military history," when what it should have turned into was a Stilwell court marshal.


Hmm, maybe I've jumped the gun a little bit, I've just noticed there has been a lot of revisionist histories that try to downplay genocidests or dictators simply because they were anti-communist. I might give this a read after I've finished my book.

Vulcan 607 wrote:Thank you! Can never have to many books!


Well, I've got no room left in my bookshelf, and the storing compartment of my wardrobe is full of books, so not entirely true...

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Re: What are you reading?

Postby Admiral Piett » Tue 4 Jul 2017 02:50

Grabbed_by_the_Spets wrote:Hmm, maybe I've jumped the gun a little bit, I've just noticed there has been a lot of revisionist histories that try to downplay genocidests or dictators simply because they were anti-communist. I might give this a read after I've finished my book.


Oh, yeah. I can understand. Taylor (and the new historiography in general) had to do a lot to convince me, since the first book I ever read involving the CBI theatre in WW2 was this:
https://www.amazon.ca/Burma-Road-Story- ... 0060746386

It was overly focused on the American side of things, centered on Stilwell, and heavily based on Barbara Tuchman's horrifically flawed work.

I'm still in the Second Sino-Japanese War sections of The Generalissimo, but so far the treatment has been very even-handed. His interactions with the Green Gang, his willingness to use sweeping repression, assassination, etc. are all things that Taylor certainly doesn't try to downplay or cover up. Chiang comes off significantly better than he has in histories prior to Taylor's work. That really isn't saying much considering the character assassination pieces and "KMT China did nothing" Cold War-era literature. I'm looking forward to the late civil war and Taiwan parts to see how Taylor handles that stuff.

I picked this up on the side. More light reading to go alongside my China tomes.

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Re: What are you reading?

Postby Vulcan 607 » Tue 4 Jul 2017 10:08

Grabbed_by_the_Spets wrote:
Admiral Piett wrote:An update on the Chiang Kai-shek bio. It is superb. I also looked into the wider literature, and it is considered the standard Chiang Kai-shek biography in English. I have gotten as far as Stilwell's almost improbably incompetent performance in Burma in 1942. Taylor adds more detail to the other new histories I have read of the campaign. In all my years of historical study, I have never seen the old historiography misrepresent events in such an inaccurate fashion. After his idiotic counteroffensive imploded, as the British and Chinese warned him it would, Stilwell literally abandoned his entire 100k-strong field command while they were still fighting as cohesive formations, and fled into India. Over the years of entirely uncritical histories, that shit-show somehow morphed into a "glorious chapter in American military history," when what it should have turned into was a Stilwell court marshal.


Hmm, maybe I've jumped the gun a little bit, I've just noticed there has been a lot of revisionist histories that try to downplay genocidests or dictators simply because they were anti-communist. I might give this a read after I've finished my book.

Vulcan 607 wrote:Thank you! Can never have to many books!


Well, I've got no room left in my bookshelf, and the storing compartment of my wardrobe is full of books, so not entirely true...


My old bookshelf collapsed one night showering me with large books some 2inches thick was a hell of a crash

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Admiral Piett
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Re: What are you reading?

Postby Admiral Piett » Tue 4 Jul 2017 21:00

Vulcan 607 wrote:
Grabbed_by_the_Spets wrote:Well, I've got no room left in my bookshelf, and the storing compartment of my wardrobe is full of books, so not entirely true...


My old bookshelf collapsed one night showering me with large books some 2inches thick was a hell of a crash


I can help with that... :D

This is likely excellent. Raymond Callahan wrote one of the best histories of the Singapore and Malaya campaign.
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