[Red Dragon] Patch v.64564 (Tech Patch)

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Re: [Red Dragon] Patch v.64564 (Tech Patch)

Postby FrangibleCover » Thu 16 Feb 2017 11:57

HrcAk47 wrote:
FrangibleCover wrote:
Oktoberfest wrote:Why is the base AMX-30 and 30B not at 50% acc when the Obus G was considered the "perfect match" for HEAT and precision. Etc...

My understanding of the round was that it was an effort to make HEAT ammunition that could be fired from rifled guns so that it was as accurate as Sabot. In game the AMX-30s have 45% accuracy [HEAT] rounds, L7 equipped tanks of similar price and vintage have 45% accuracy [KE] rounds. I'm not seeing the issue.

Nope. All HEAT rounds of the era spin, thanks to the rifled barrels. Obus G just doesn't suffer from centrifugal force disrupting the HEAT jet.

Okay, 'could be fired from rifled guns with full effectiveness'. The point remains that putting ball bearings in your shell doesn't magically make it into a commie seeking missile (Indeed I'd be interested in the weird gyroscopic effects caused by only some of the shell rotating but they're probably negligible), the accuracy is still mostly dependent on the FCS. Does anyone have comparative data between the FCS of the AMX-30 and, say, the Leopard 1A2 that could justify accuracy buffs?
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Re: [Red Dragon] Patch v.64564 (Tech Patch)

Postby Oktoberfest » Thu 16 Feb 2017 12:04

HrcAk47 wrote:
FrangibleCover wrote:
Oktoberfest wrote:Why is the base AMX-30 and 30B not at 50% acc when the Obus G was considered the "perfect match" for HEAT and precision. Etc...

My understanding of the round was that it was an effort to make HEAT ammunition that could be fired from rifled guns so that it was as accurate as Sabot. In game the AMX-30s have 45% accuracy [HEAT] rounds, L7 equipped tanks of similar price and vintage have 45% accuracy [KE] rounds. I'm not seeing the issue.


Nope. All HEAT rounds of the era spin, thanks to the rifled barrels. Obus G just doesn't suffer from centrifugal force disrupting the HEAT jet.


OK, so, accuracy aside, 45% being OK, it should have an efficient HEAT round (400mm pen RHA IRL at any distance). Why is it outmatched by a 300mm RHA round from the T-34-85 :(

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Re: [Red Dragon] Patch v.64564 (Tech Patch)

Postby HrcAk47 » Thu 16 Feb 2017 12:05

Neither had a FCS until later. :D

45% acc is still way better over what T-55A gets, a contemporary.

Also, all HEAT rounds in tanks underperform compared to ATGMs (special scale, here it would be 14) or handhelds (even more special scale, here it would be 18).
The SEAD never bothered me anyway.

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Re: [Red Dragon] Patch v.64564 (Tech Patch)

Postby Oktoberfest » Thu 16 Feb 2017 14:33

HrcAk47 wrote:Neither had a FCS until later. :D

45% acc is still way better over what T-55A gets, a contemporary.

Also, all HEAT rounds in tanks underperform compared to ATGMs (special scale, here it would be 14) or handhelds (even more special scale, here it would be 18).


Fact in game : T-34-85 = 10 AP HEAT for 300 mm RHA and AMX-30/30B = 9 AP HEAT for 400 mm of penetration.
It's not underperforming. It's one has the recognized 30mm penetration = 1 AP while the other has 1 AP for 44,44 mm of penetration....

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Re: [Red Dragon] Patch v.64564 (Tech Patch)

Postby HrcAk47 » Thu 16 Feb 2017 16:18

Oktoberfest wrote:
HrcAk47 wrote:Neither had a FCS until later. :D

45% acc is still way better over what T-55A gets, a contemporary.

Also, all HEAT rounds in tanks underperform compared to ATGMs (special scale, here it would be 14) or handhelds (even more special scale, here it would be 18).


Fact in game : T-34-85 = 10 AP HEAT for 300 mm RHA and AMX-30/30B = 9 AP HEAT for 400 mm of penetration.
It's not underperforming. It's one has the recognized 30mm penetration = 1 AP while the other has 1 AP for 44,44 mm of penetration....


To be quite honest, the game is chock-full of inconsistencies (as much as you'll hate it, the DLC nations are good just because they have less inconsistencies).

They are everywhere. From the nations using imaginary stuff (T-55AM2 in Soviet use, Super Dragon in US use), to nations not getting the nicer variants of stuff they could get (no Strela 10M3 for Redfor, no Kub M3 for Redfor...), to nations not getting absolutely iconic gear they had (no T-80UD, no F-15E...)

That all being considered, one HEAT round underperforming is the least of the problems. Even at 14 HEAT (generous), nobody will use it, as it would get price nerfed back into oblivion. Why are you so upset? Let's wait for WG4 and try to fix stuff there.
The SEAD never bothered me anyway.

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Re: [Red Dragon] Patch v.64564 (Tech Patch)

Postby Mike » Thu 16 Feb 2017 19:09

Oktoberfest wrote:Let's say that when I see a T-34-85 with more firepower than an AMX-30B, I tend to raise an eyebrow.


You lose your shit and it's the best way to assure that you get ignored.
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Re: [Red Dragon] Patch v.64564 (Tech Patch)

Postby Oktoberfest » Fri 17 Feb 2017 00:26

Mike wrote:
Oktoberfest wrote:Let's say that when I see a T-34-85 with more firepower than an AMX-30B, I tend to raise an eyebrow.


You lose your shit and it's the best way to assure that you get ignored.


I don't lose my shit. I am just... Vocal. :geek:

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Re: [Red Dragon] Patch v.64564 (Tech Patch)

Postby Mike » Fri 17 Feb 2017 00:35

Oktoberfest wrote:
Mike wrote:
Oktoberfest wrote:Let's say that when I see a T-34-85 with more firepower than an AMX-30B, I tend to raise an eyebrow.


You lose your shit and it's the best way to assure that you get ignored.


I don't lose my shit. I am just... Vocal. :geek:


Just giving you feedback. Take it as you will.
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Re: [Red Dragon] Patch v.64564 (Tech Patch)

Postby KattiValk » Fri 17 Feb 2017 05:27

Mike wrote:Just giving you feedback. Take it as you will.
Just look at your post count, you clearly don't have the experience to give advice like this!

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Re: [Red Dragon] Patch v.64564 (Tech Patch)

Postby Mike » Fri 17 Feb 2017 07:08

KattiValk wrote:
Mike wrote:Just giving you feedback. Take it as you will.
Just look at your post count, you clearly don't have the experience to give advice like this!


I make up over 1% of all post on the forums!
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