About the promised buffs to RD

User avatar
HrcAk47
Colonel
Posts: 2730
Joined: Sat 3 May 2014 18:00
Contact:

Re: About the promised buffs to RD

Postby HrcAk47 » Sat 20 May 2017 09:58

Fade2Gray wrote:
FrangibleCover wrote:
Fade2Gray wrote:Something like an MLRS smoker.

Bring back smoke rocket aircraft!

You know, with all these trash rocket planes that RD has, that would be amazing to have if you reroled one.. Give it a massive rocket payload, really horribad ACC so it spreads them all over, and it would be pretty unique and flavorful.


RDs have loads of trash MLRS too, nobody will notice if one or two get smoke :)
The SEAD never bothered me anyway.

SMB Yugoslavia Retexture Mod, now released, v.1.0

User avatar
Mike
More than 10 000 messages. Soldier you are the leader of all armies!
Posts: 12096
Joined: Thu 20 Feb 2014 01:09
Location: Virginia, United States of America
Contact:

Re: About the promised buffs to RD

Postby Mike » Mon 29 May 2017 04:11

Fade2Gray wrote:
FrangibleCover wrote:
Fade2Gray wrote:Something like an MLRS smoker.

Bring back smoke rocket aircraft!

You know, with all these trash rocket planes that RD has, that would be amazing to have if you reroled one.. Give it a massive rocket payload, really horribad ACC so it spreads them all over, and it would be pretty unique and flavorful.


SD has planes with smoke bombs.
Image
Courtesy of KattiValk

User avatar
another505
More than 10 000 messages. Soldier you are the leader of all armies!
Posts: 12940
Joined: Sun 21 Jul 2013 05:18
Location: Hiatus
Contact:

Re: About the promised buffs to RD

Postby another505 » Mon 12 Jun 2017 06:09

Playing RD again,

I really dont see much purpose of the deck still. Everytime I pick RD i wonder to myself, why i am actually handicapping myself and my team. I actually rather play like Soviet airborne or finland national, despite they having glaring weakness, they have huge advantages that can be use.


I know it seems i am cherry picking because most of the examples i relate to are like the best, but there is easily more better ones that i just didnt list.

If there is another patch, please be merciful and give RD a hand. I know you have, FLX, but before the buffs there were nerfs and powercreep so it still hasnt been good.

I would think 4 things that make it a lot more better without being broken

Zhanshi 85 to 10pts or give it a better MG. RD really needs an efficient line infantry. Even 10 pts is not that great....

Su27sk. I know this has been asked soooo many times. But can you at least make one of its missiles to be 60 percent accuracy, preferably the MRAAM and keep its veterancy, or make them both 55? Missile accuracy is a huge important factor, 10 percent difference from other missiles is a huge disadvantage. Even with this buff i would still think Su27sk is below average if you guys so desire it to be bad... at least not terrible.

B-5 to 2 per card. Its weaker than f111c or f15d. It has a bigger bomb but less concentrated damage and waaaay less survivability. ASF can easily shoot it down as it has no ecm.


MDS 500 AGL to recon with good optics. RD needs something to fly to protect flanks with a bit of firepower. And for opening to cover the ty90. most nations can take something like that in recon. Making you save AP and the helicopter tab of RD is just redundant...


What I think of RD per category.
Spoiler : :
Log below average- you have a nice tank cv for its price, but you lack big supply trucks or helo. A good rocket helo for your infantry cv.

Infantry average. YOu lack atgm, heavy AT infantry are very expensive. PF 89 sometimes just dont cut it. Line infantry is crap but the shock infantry are nothing special. Lijian 75 is the only one that is better than other SF but you can't rely on SF in this meta.

IFV - decent. BTR80a, wz551,strela bus are good. But all three of them in limited by their choice. For example wz551 are trapped in lie ren that comes limited avail, tanke 85 that is very restricted in usage, and lijian 90 that is frankly crap. Lijian 75 which is a very nice infantry doesnt have access to it
BTR80a is limited to yuck 90 basically (cause no one uses the NK marine cause they are bad) which comes 7 per card
And ZSD 90 comes in either crap zhanshi 85 or luzhandui 90 that makes them very expensive

AA average. But it lacks a general anti everything like roland 3, osa akm, tor. So you actually need to spend 3 cards of AA and buy them in case of specific circumstances. Other coalition could buy mainly IR aa with good ASF to cover, but for RD you need both IR and RAD AA...
Cause that supbar su27sk aint going to even beat most average ASFs...

Tanks good, but not great. I am really grateful for ztz88a and chomaho5, and the strela tank , it is hilarious.

Artillery -terrible, you lack long range artillery to counter. You get average mortars, not even great ones like W-Ger. Your MLRS are crap and redundant.

Recon- Good, Lie Ren are one of the best 20pts shock recon, and wz551 that comes with it are nice. ZTQ-62g has been outshined by finland/dutch/yugo but still decent, but other ztq are crap in comparison.



Helicopters- bad- Other than Ty90 , most of them are just bad. HJ8 has good stats but still expensive when most of the time when it is effective(no AA) a Hot 2 or tow 2 helicopter is cheaper.
Mi25, its not bad, but you have to take a card of it! when redfor in general can take as a transport which is great


Vehicle- good, but doesnt save the deck. Lacks a good cheap fsv, thanks for the su100 buff but it still not worth it. Wz550 and ptz89 is nice but niche usage. PTZ 89 is this game is just not good. You can't One hit kill most units. so enemy can return fire to your measly 5fav. ambushing does not yield great returns using tanks. Infantry yield great returns since they can take at least 2 HE rounds in the face and they are a lot cheaper.




Planes. You got the J7h which is average with now the Yugo L-15
you got the b-5 which is crap compare to f111c or even most bombers cause its 1 per card bomber.. Yea it makes a big boom, but it dies to asf unlike f15d or f111c, and your ASF can't even cover it!

ATGM planes are below average. you dont have something like 30ap atgm seria which is frankly an average atgm plane across coalitions
Q-5d is also average especially with something like kurnass flying in the air
Image
Of Salt

CrusaderVM
Corporal
Posts: 22
Joined: Sat 31 Jan 2015 12:24
Contact:

Re: About the promised buffs to RD

Postby CrusaderVM » Tue 4 Jul 2017 19:42

Why not make Red Dragons the human wave faction? Make all their low-to-mid end stuff 5-10 points cheaper than they otherwise should be, and have them be a faction that just shrugs off attrition through the Peoples' Revolutionary Spirit and the indomitable Strength of Juche. Having to spend less on core/line/average units means more points in the bank to spend on the higher-end gear as the match goes on.

We have factions that specialize in affordable shock infantry, factions that specialize in heavy tanks, factions that specialize in wheeled firepower, factions that specialize in airpower, etc and so on. But no faction that specializes in overall cost efficiency (though that's debatable with Entente and FinPol :D ). Seems like a spot that RD could fill, and you'd just have to adjust some prices here and there rather than introducing entirely new units.

Norks should have cheaper artillery with slightly buffed fire rate as their flavor. Like make the Tokchons aim and shoot faster than they should. Probably not accurate to reality but who cares, the nation needs a niche and having 'steel rain' be their forte would be unique.

User avatar
McNash
Lieutenant
Posts: 1182
Joined: Sun 15 Apr 2012 18:06
Contact:

Re: About the promised buffs to RD

Postby McNash » Sun 9 Jul 2017 19:03

CrusaderVM wrote:Why not make Red Dragons the human wave faction? Make all their low-to-mid end stuff 5-10 points cheaper than they otherwise should be, and have them be a faction that just shrugs off attrition through the Peoples' Revolutionary Spirit and the indomitable Strength of Juche. Having to spend less on core/line/average units means more points in the bank to spend on the higher-end gear as the match goes on.

We have factions that specialize in affordable shock infantry, factions that specialize in heavy tanks, factions that specialize in wheeled firepower, factions that specialize in airpower, etc and so on. But no faction that specializes in overall cost efficiency (though that's debatable with Entente and FinPol :D ). Seems like a spot that RD could fill, and you'd just have to adjust some prices here and there rather than introducing entirely new units.

Norks should have cheaper artillery with slightly buffed fire rate as their flavor. Like make the Tokchons aim and shoot faster than they should. Probably not accurate to reality but who cares, the nation needs a niche and having 'steel rain' be their forte would be unique.


5pts regulars would be extremely amusing, maybe just take away the AT weapon to justify the price.
Image

User avatar
integ3r
Lieutenant
Posts: 1136
Joined: Mon 3 Jun 2013 03:10
Contact:

Re: About the promised buffs to RD

Postby integ3r » Mon 10 Jul 2017 00:30

Played a bit of RD.

Iglabus with Line-inf is a great deal in general, also good for heli rushers. Strelabus was of dubious effectiveness, but iglabus is great.
The chinese heavy tank is quite good for its cost.
Nork Mig29 is alright. In fact air-force is pretty decent overall.

I rely on iglabuses quite a lot, not getting a cortale unless I need it to stop a Longbow or something and it just works out. A 3 stack of buses consistently kill/punish planes.

It doesn't seem exceptionally bad, IMO they're quite fun to play right now. I mean, you can't beat Yugo, but what can? That's just the way it is. Scandi seems pretty bad though.

I think RD is in an alright place. The tank with the Strela on it isn't that great though.
"How do into gaem of war? How 2 git gud?":
Spoiler : :

Fodder
Master Sergeant
Posts: 192
Joined: Fri 7 Oct 2016 20:15
Contact:

Re: About the promised buffs to RD

Postby Fodder » Mon 10 Jul 2017 07:29

integ3r wrote:Played a bit of RD.

Iglabus with Line-inf is a great deal in general, also good for heli rushers. Strelabus was of dubious effectiveness, but iglabus is great.
The chinese heavy tank is quite good for its cost.
Nork Mig29 is alright. In fact air-force is pretty decent overall.

I rely on iglabuses quite a lot, not getting a cortale unless I need it to stop a Longbow or something and it just works out. A 3 stack of buses consistently kill/punish planes.

It doesn't seem exceptionally bad, IMO they're quite fun to play right now. I mean, you can't beat Yugo, but what can? That's just the way it is. Scandi seems pretty bad though.

I think RD is in an alright place. The tank with the Strela on it isn't that great though.


RD has no high end arty piece.
Also RD airforce has a ton of short range ASF. (mig 21 w/ 30% Acc missiles) :(

McNash wrote:
5pts regulars would be extremely amusing, maybe just take away the AT weapon to justify the price.

5pts Regulars? Thats authenic! LOL :lol:
No rations until u kill HATO dogs!
Last edited by Fodder on Tue 11 Jul 2017 21:01, edited 5 times in total.

Gen3ralAustria
Master Sergeant
Posts: 156
Joined: Fri 21 Feb 2014 19:47
Location: Gramastetten, Mühlviertel, Upper Austria (OÖ), Austria
Contact:

Re: About the promised buffs to RD

Postby Gen3ralAustria » Mon 10 Jul 2017 11:54

CrusaderVM wrote:Why not make Red Dragons the human wave faction? Make all their low-to-mid end stuff 5-10 points cheaper than they otherwise should be, and have them be a faction that just shrugs off attrition through the Peoples' Revolutionary Spirit and the indomitable Strength of Juche. Having to spend less on core/line/average units means more points in the bank to spend on the higher-end gear as the match goes on.

We have factions that specialize in affordable shock infantry, factions that specialize in heavy tanks, factions that specialize in wheeled firepower, factions that specialize in airpower, etc and so on. But no faction that specializes in overall cost efficiency (though that's debatable with Entente and FinPol :D ). Seems like a spot that RD could fill, and you'd just have to adjust some prices here and there rather than introducing entirely new units.

Norks should have cheaper artillery with slightly buffed fire rate as their flavor. Like make the Tokchons aim and shoot faster than they should. Probably not accurate to reality but who cares, the nation needs a niche and having 'steel rain' be their forte would be unique.


To the human wave idea: you know this is going to fail? Imagine this: you have for example 16-20 units of cheap regulars attack a city, some of them without good AT options etc., they will fail unless they don't get good support by either other land forces or air power.
They'd have to start their attack from about 1000-1500 meters (there they group up, etc.) away from the first city buildings, a lot of probably open space.
In this distance they will face MG, tank, artillery, auto cannon and even rifle fire. They would mostly be demolished before you reach the first line. Even when you would do it with all options and off the book (smoke, planes, artillery, allies assisting) it would still cause huge losses to you before you are able to achieve anything, maybe rout or crash the first line but the second line would easily pick the rest of your forces off. When your enemy is mobile it is even worse, for example mounting a delaying action until support (helicopter etc.) arrives.
To make sure, this is only my opinion on it, you may think otherwise and I accept this.

RD has it's leaks, true, but not only them. West Germany, ANZAC too, not as grave but still. Personally I don't expect any more things for the game since SD is now on the line and the game being quite old already it probably won't happen any time soon.
Austria for Wargame:RD as National Pack!

thelizardofdoom
Sergeant First-Class
Posts: 126
Joined: Sat 2 Apr 2016 10:15
Contact:

Re: About the promised buffs to RD

Postby thelizardofdoom » Thu 13 Jul 2017 11:40

Gen3ralAustria wrote:They'd have to start their attack from about 1000-1500 meters (there they group up, etc.) away from the first city buildings, a lot of probably open space


This quote kind of demonstrates you don't know about what your speaking of. Among other in your post. Even if that were true it is irrelevant because the same thing would happen against normally priced infantry. And the your mentioning single nations. Balancing coalitions is far more important and what the game is themed on
Yes im aware my grammar and spelling are dreadful. Email complaints to android for having terrible software or eugen for having a mobile unfriendly site.

User avatar
Stranger Danger
Private First-Class
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat 28 Jan 2017 19:54
Contact:

Re: About the promised buffs to RD

Postby Stranger Danger » Thu 13 Jul 2017 14:11

I feel all this post and similar ones are a giant speculative circle jerk, I mean no word from any EUG member on the forums since the last patch, no acknowledgement of WG:RD being at the least level of balance of the last 2 years due to red and blue cancer DLCs, nothing on the (absurd) pricing of the KPVT and Bushmaster trucks (for opposite reasons) etc etc.

Anything from them would be good, even "We're not supporting this game with patches anymore, deal with it hon hon hon". Instead what we just get "Steel Division's community rocks" type of shit.
Of course they're working on Steel Division (that doesn't even have OSX/Linux support), but I don't think writing something just to show they're here is so resource intensive that they can't actually do that. It just reinforces the feeling that we've been milked with the DLCs, even though this might not have been their original intent. The fact that the rebalancing right after the REDS DLC was done on the goodwill of one staff member is fucking absurd and feels half-assed on their part, just like some of the "balancing" decisions. I'd like to say I trust them to come back and fix the inconsistencies that have been pointed out in many posts, but the truth is I don't, and it's sad since this could probably the best RTS-RTT around for many years to come.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Azaz3l, Bing [Bot] and 37 guests