West-Germany (or hoping without hope)

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FrangibleCover
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Re: West-Germany (or hoping without hope)

Postby FrangibleCover » Thu 21 Sep 2017 09:43

nuke92 wrote:was this one ever used?

Argentina had (static) Roland in the Falklands, Iraq had both AMX-30 and MAN truck mounted Roland in the Iraq-Iran War and the Gulf War and I expect the French had it in the Gulf War as well. Wiki claims a multitude of kills for the system but I've got nothing on their actual combat Pk.
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Oktoberfest
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Re: West-Germany (or hoping without hope)

Postby Oktoberfest » Thu 21 Sep 2017 10:41

FrangibleCover wrote:
nuke92 wrote:was this one ever used?

Argentina had (static) Roland in the Falklands, Iraq had both AMX-30 and MAN truck mounted Roland in the Iraq-Iran War and the Gulf War and I expect the French had it in the Gulf War as well. Wiki claims a multitude of kills for the system but I've got nothing on their actual combat Pk.


What's more important with the Roland is the reload time. IRL, the reload is 10 seconds. In game, it's also 10 seconds. But systems with way longer reload times IRL get to reload significantly faster IG, comparatively speaking.

Reload time of the Roland should be reduce to 3-5 seconds max.

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Markenzwieback
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Re: West-Germany (or hoping without hope)

Postby Markenzwieback » Thu 21 Sep 2017 10:44

Oktoberfest wrote:What's more important with the Roland is the reload time. IRL, the reload is 10 seconds. In game, it's also 10 seconds. But systems with way longer reload times IRL get to reload significantly faster IG, comparatively speaking.

Reload time of the Roland should be reduce to 3-5 seconds max.

This.
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Re: West-Germany (or hoping without hope)

Postby GARGEAN » Thu 21 Sep 2017 11:07

Sunshine wrote:
Long story short, I asked a few ex-Leopard 1 operators (German army) years ago because I wanted to hear something definite and out of first hand and they confirmed this and even explained why it was so fast.
I posted this like 10 times already here, so I dug it up for you here.
Interestingly enough, a Leo 1 tanker from Norway said this as well - unrelated to my research, and someone here posted that as well, but I do not remember who, when and where, sorry. Old topic.

Long story short, T-64A/80 autoloader has sequence when it completes reload in less that 5 seconds. T-80UM to 12 RoF when?

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nuke92
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Re: West-Germany (or hoping without hope)

Postby nuke92 » Thu 21 Sep 2017 13:22

FrangibleCover wrote:
nuke92 wrote:was this one ever used?

Argentina had (static) Roland in the Falklands, Iraq had both AMX-30 and MAN truck mounted Roland in the Iraq-Iran War and the Gulf War and I expect the French had it in the Gulf War as well. Wiki claims a multitude of kills for the system but I've got nothing on their actual combat Pk.


Ok, thats also good to know :)
Actually I meant the Roland 3 with 4 ready to launch missiles, my mistake.

edit: I've heared about the A-10 that got wrecked by a Roland in Iraq.
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Sunshine
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Re: West-Germany (or hoping without hope)

Postby Sunshine » Thu 21 Sep 2017 13:27

GARGEAN wrote:Long story short, T-64A/80 autoloader has sequence when it completes reload in less that 5 seconds. T-80UM to 12 RoF when?
Autoloaders aren't used because they are faster (because they usually aren't), they are used to reduce size and weight, especially weight.

Your number of <5 seconds cycle time makes me rather suspicious.
First, the cycle time, minimum, is around 6-6.5 seconds from all sources I could find.
I do not say they are right or wrong, yet they stand in stark contrast to your so far unsupported claim of <5 seconds.

The only 'source' I could find that supports the <5 seconds cycle time claim is Wikipedia - with no source being linked/named to back it up.

Also, everything I find on the T-80UM supports a rate of fire of 6-8 rounds per minute.
Are my information wrong, maybe?
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Re: West-Germany (or hoping without hope)

Postby Bougnas » Thu 21 Sep 2017 15:23

nuke92 wrote:
FrangibleCover wrote:
nuke92 wrote:was this one ever used?

Argentina had (static) Roland in the Falklands, Iraq had both AMX-30 and MAN truck mounted Roland in the Iraq-Iran War and the Gulf War and I expect the French had it in the Gulf War as well. Wiki claims a multitude of kills for the system but I've got nothing on their actual combat Pk.


Ok, thats also good to know :)
Actually I meant the Roland 3 with 4 ready to launch missiles, my mistake.

edit: I've heared about the A-10 that got wrecked by a Roland in Iraq.



This was only offered for export. Neither France nor Germany got it.
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Re: West-Germany (or hoping without hope)

Postby GARGEAN » Thu 21 Sep 2017 16:29

Sunshine wrote:
GARGEAN wrote:Long story short, T-64A/80 autoloader has sequence when it completes reload in less that 5 seconds. T-80UM to 12 RoF when?
Autoloaders aren't used because they are faster (because they usually aren't), they are used to reduce size and weight, especially weight.

Your number of <5 seconds cycle time makes me rather suspicious.
First, the cycle time, minimum, is around 6-6.5 seconds from all sources I could find.
I do not say they are right or wrong, yet they stand in stark contrast to your so far unsupported claim of <5 seconds.

The only 'source' I could find that supports the <5 seconds cycle time claim is Wikipedia - with no source being linked/named to back it up.

Also, everything I find on the T-80UM supports a rate of fire of 6-8 rounds per minute.
Are my information wrong, maybe?

Blah-blah, no source in internet... There is sequence mode, when operations if loading next round of same type starts right after loading current round, thus overlapping with firing sequence. That frees around 1.1 second of loading time. Quite similar to your beloved lap-loading, eh?
And yeap, T-80UM has 6-8 RoF IRL. You know why? Because this is BATTLE RoF. Tanks usually don't roll around firing without stop. There is time for searching, aiming, receiving fire solution from FCS and a shitload of other stuff.

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Re: West-Germany (or hoping without hope)

Postby urogard » Thu 21 Sep 2017 16:41

Markenzwieback wrote:
Oktoberfest wrote:What's more important with the Roland is the reload time. IRL, the reload is 10 seconds. In game, it's also 10 seconds. But systems with way longer reload times IRL get to reload significantly faster IG, comparatively speaking.

Reload time of the Roland should be reduce to 3-5 seconds max.

This.

more like 1 sec between shots and 2 secs between reloads...

also fixing roland availability when?
osa line got needed avail buff long ago, rolands are still waiting

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Sunshine
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Re: West-Germany (or hoping without hope)

Postby Sunshine » Thu 21 Sep 2017 17:07

GARGEAN wrote:Blah-blah, no source in internet...

Ah yes, you're one of those. I forgot.
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