RedFor, Eastern Block, National Decks (+ few other questions)

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steppewolf
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Re: RedFor, Eastern Block, National Decks (+ few other questions)

Postby steppewolf » Thu 18 May 2017 15:01

Adarius wrote:General deck
This is a completely new deck that I have not yet played with. I got all my favourite tank units but at much worse veterancy and in return I get better infantry, better helicopters and slightly improved air defense.

The general ideas is that LSTR, Formoza and the Polish Berets give me superiority in forests/flanking engagements while the Wachtregiment with their submachine guns and 15 HP should be extremely powerful in city fighting. I do however feel that the infantry tab is overly biased towards expensive units and would also like to get some proper artillery into the deck. Infantry in a helicopter gunship is also lacking.


I have played a lot with general EB deck so here my 2 cents:

LOG: I don't think you need a second truck; keep 30 pts one and get a FOB especially if you are looking for some arty.

INF: Niebirskie is not cost effective, there are very few 15 men squads who can be called cost effective so I'd drop them. Wachtregiment may be fine in a moto decks but in a general deck its AT weapon is just too weak to be able to deal with enemy armor;
I'd pick: Konkurs-M/Vydra II or Mi-17, MotSchutzen 90s/ BMP-2, MotSchutzen 90s/MT-LB, LStR / SPW-80 and last card can be:
MotSchutzen in BMP-1 SP-1
Granatomers (excellent fire support infantry) /Vydra II
Motostrelci/ BVP-2 vz.86 for the IFV if you like to support your tanks with it.

SUP: if you look for long range accurate howitzers for counter arty than Ondava should do the trick as it's one of the best in game howitzers. If you're after rocket arty use MFRW RM-70. It's 7HE, good ammo storage and can also smoke.
I'd stay with TOR ( a versatile system) instead of Tunguska and with Sopel in Strop 2's place. This last one is good and fast but you have LStR in wheels for fast openings. OSA-AKM is a fast versatile AA and many players use it as the backbone of their ADN as it can be pushed relatively fast near the frontline.

TNK: Dyna doesn't work outside armored deck at best veterancy because of accuracy.
T-72M1M could be used as a deterrent but accuracy is still bad
Usually the like of tanks for Moderna, Twardy, Wilk II, Wilk I and Merida :) I know, you seem to feel the lack of GLATGMs but this can be covered by Konkurs-M, Konkurs-M IFV and PRAM-S Konkurs-M; plenty of rockets I think, even if you decide eventually not to pick Motostrelci

REC: Pruzkumnci in truck -> 25 pts! It's a must have and it is an unit easily spreadable across the map. I like to have Specialny and Formoza together. Both come in ground transports as I feel the choppers they have as options don't add much to the deck. I like Formoza in SPW-40 which is a recon vehicle which I use it for passive spotting after unloading. Actually I think you can get Specialny in Mi-17 as that is a good chopper. Salamandra is okaish but kind of costly so for small pts game look at AHs Mi-3.

VEH: PRAM-S is a nice tool to support armor as it can hit directly infantry with its 120 mm weapon and have Konkurs-M. Cheap and versatile fire support but keep it protected at range. ZSU-57-2, SPW-152E, ASU-85 could be good spammable low cost FSV. I don't like ASU-85 but I've seen it recommended by many so maybe they know something. See what works for you.

HELO: DHS M24P is probably your best helo but use it with caution, I am picking it as a flank guard and a sweeper but most of the time I pick W-3W Sokol for this role and also as an escort for my opening. Mi-35 and Mi-24P are the next choices.

AIR: Plenty of options...I see you like Su-25 but there are other options you could look at

You have interesting SEAD options. Polish SU-22 one have ripple fire capability and is a better killer of AA RAD platforms while German one have also AA missiles and I use it sometimes to pick helos which venture too far and escaped of my AA net. Usually I take the Polish one in big games and DDR one in small games.

For ASF you have to pick between East German one which many say is the meta, it's a good dogfighter also or Polish one which have longer range missiles but you have to have it aiming at the target during the flight of missiles. I prefer the former to pick enemy bombers; I usually take two ASFs if I don't have much AA so I pick between Lazur (excellent dogfighter which can mop up behind you main ASFs , pick helos or could be sent in front as a bait) or Czechoslovak MIG-23s at maximum veterancy.

As bombers, I usually pick between Czechoslovak MIG-29 with napalm bombs or East German MIG-25 with iron bombs. It's a matter of preference in the end. For low points games Su-7BM could be an option as bomber ; L-39 ZA also could be useful for low points game as can pick infantry with bombs or helos with AA missiles; MIG-21M could be useful in openings with napalm bombs to temporarily block roads and have great speed which may give it a chance of survival; MIG-21ML is a cheap multirole which can take soft targets with rockets or helos/bombers with missiles.

I hope it helps and I am looking forward to play again!

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Re: RedFor, Eastern Block, National Decks (+ few other questions)

Postby Adarius » Fri 19 May 2017 13:30

I have done some revisions now but got the wrong computer so that will have to wait and I might as well try the deck out as well before putting up more images.

Logistics: I am getting quite skeptical about FOBs in general. Bringing on a Kolos is more expensive but supplies per card is better and the points for bringing them on are spread out throughout the game.

Infantry: 8 LSTR in return for sacrificing all the benefits of the Armoured deck is a bit hefty. I know the reasoning that 15 HP units tend to get stunned anyway when a 10 HP unit would die. In my experience however the 15 HP units can be a considerable annoyance as they are hard to kill in transports and be extremely hard to wipe out in cities/forests when they run around. Therefore I am quite tempted by the thought of having 700 m RPG range in a solid infantry unit for annoyance purposes but I will test it out and I expect either they or the Wachtmen will have to go.

Support: Odava is in and I changed the rest except for the Strop2 which I am very excited to try. Wheeled SPAAG with 2800 m range is something that can win ranked games on its own when facing rushers.

Tank: I don't think 50 % accuracy is that bad but will test PRAM-S instead of the Dyna or M1M as they fulfill a similar role. I do however find it hard to see how M1M can be bad, the 85 pts Wilks seem to be very highly rated and the M1M trade 1/9 of firepower and 5 pts premium for the ATGM.

REC: What makes the Pruzkumnci so good? It seems like a more durable but visible version of the Schwimmers to me. Right now I am leaning towards an infantry heavy tab (Pruzkumnci, Schwimmers, Formoza and Grenzers + Salamander) which will cause issues when pushing even if the addition of the SPW-40 transport will partially offset this.

Air: Took the suggested jets.

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Re: RedFor, Eastern Block, National Decks (+ few other questions)

Postby steppewolf » Fri 19 May 2017 14:24

REC: What makes the Pruzkumnci so good? It seems like a more durable but visible version of the Schwimmers to me. Right now I am leaning towards an infantry heavy tab (Pruzkumnci, Schwimmers, Formoza and Grenzers + Salamander) which will cause issues when pushing even if the addition of the SPW-40 transport will partially offset this.


Well, you have too much infantry, I'd drop Scwimmers/Grenzers.

Pruzkumnci is a shock squad with a scoped rifle coming in a cheapest possible transport. You can spread them with small expanses across the map and hunt enemy recon squads and ATGMs.

Snezka is a nice and cheap autocannon which I use for observation for infantry in tracked transports and armored/mechanized groups.

Salamandra is decent but I feel I overpay but sometimes is handy (I am not a big fan of helicopters for this deck, I like more boots on ground)

I use sometimes Formoza (in SPW 40 which is used as passive spotter after unloading and kind of fill the role of passive spotting of Grenzers) and Specialny 90s (in wheeled transport) in team for raids in forested/urban areas. First one stun infantry quickly, the Czech elites have an excellent AT weapon hence the idea to pair them.

I'd only take Schwimmers in helo for long destruction game to spot behind enemy lines for my Ondavas.

Infantry: 8 LSTR in return for sacrificing all the benefits of the Armoured deck is a bit hefty. I know the reasoning that 15 HP units tend to get stunned anyway when a 10 HP unit would die. In my experience however the 15 HP units can be a considerable annoyance as they are hard to kill in transports and be extremely hard to wipe out in cities/forests when they run around. Therefore I am quite tempted by the thought of having 700 m RPG range in a solid infantry unit for annoyance purposes but I will test it out and I expect either they or the Wachtmen will have to go.


15 men infantry squads are rarely cost effective and you have the nice infantry there, you can spam MotSchutze in cost effective transports. My tab is the following: LStR/SPW-80, Konkurs-M/Vydra, MotSchutz 90s/BMP-2 SP1, Mot-Schutz 90s/MT-LB and a free card depending on map (I change it pretty often).

Logistics: I am getting quite skeptical about FOBs in general. Bringing on a Kolos is more expensive but supplies per card is better and the points for bringing them on are spread out throughout the game.


If you want to use MLRS, you definentely will need a FOB

What jets did you picked in the end?

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Re: RedFor, Eastern Block, National Decks (+ few other questions)

Postby James-Bond » Sat 20 May 2017 09:16

steppewolf wrote:...
For ASF you have to pick between East German one which many say is the meta, it's a good dogfighter also or Polish one which have longer range missiles but you have to have it aiming at the target during the flight of missiles. I prefer the former to pick enemy bombers; I usually take two ASFs if I don't have much AA so I pick between Lazur (excellent dogfighter which can mop up behind you main ASFs , pick helos or could be sent in front as a bait) or Czechoslovak MIG-23s at maximum veterancy.
...


Very interesting & useful information, but the bit about the 2nd card of ASF caught my attention.
How come your 2nd card isn't the other MiG 29 ASF?


(Depending on income / enemy Air intensity determines how many ASF is bought)
I Buy E-Ger MiG-29 1st, so when i eventually buy the Polish MiG's
the planes come out in formation of E-Ger in the front and Pol in the Back
The Reason I do this is to get maximum missile output.
they pretty much all target the enemy at the same time this way,
so even if I pull away, that's 4 missiles heading toward the enemy.

Spoiler : Glorious MiG-29's destroying Enemy Planes :
Image
Image



Also on the subject on 15 man teams.
what your thoughts on "Komandosi" I like them
- Only REDFOR 15 man Special Forces
- AKS-74U (Carbine)
- 35pts (all SF 15 man teams are this price) other 15 man rifle squads are 25/30pts

I know the AP(15) on the AT weapon is terrible, but atleast it has 875m Range
(correct me if im wrong here)
I think most wheel transport is max 2 armour, which only takes 1 hit to destroy.
Then even the tough IFVs with 5 Front Armour die in 2 shots?
Now Tanks can be trouble, but not impossible.
one time I stumbled across a M1A2 in a forest, with 2x Komandosi, i made both squads go around the tank in different directions, so the tank had to turn to face one of the squads, managed to destroy it with a shot to the rear.

note: if there was ever a Komandosi 90' with updated AT weapon (Vampyr or RPG-26) I'd be extremely happy.

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Re: RedFor, Eastern Block, National Decks (+ few other questions)

Postby Adarius » Mon 22 May 2017 00:01

Current air tab is:

2 Mig-29 9-135
1 Su-25K
1 Su-22M4 Serla
2 SU 22M4p

But very open to change.

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Re: RedFor, Eastern Block, National Decks (+ few other questions)

Postby steppewolf » Wed 24 May 2017 11:54

James-Bond wrote:Very interesting & useful information, but the bit about the 2nd card of ASF caught my attention.
How come your 2nd card isn't the other MiG 29 ASF?

(Depending on income / enemy Air intensity determines how many ASF is bought)
I Buy E-Ger MiG-29 1st, so when i eventually buy the Polish MiG's
the planes come out in formation of E-Ger in the front and Pol in the Back
The Reason I do this is to get maximum missile output.
they pretty much all target the enemy at the same time this way,
so even if I pull away, that's 4 missiles heading toward the enemy.


Well, maybe in a high income 10v10 but as cost, having 4 MIG-29s from EB is like 570 pts so what will you have left for boots on ground or bombers?

Also sometimes your planes have to hunt enemy helos and against an Apache of Ka-52/Mi-28/Ka-50 you dont want to risk a 29 hence you have as options MIG-21 Lazur or Jugo L-17K who can fire two missiles in the same time. I like my AA net to be diverse, I don't rely only on one type of defense. High end ASFs are good, they can reach any part of map at max speed but it's not the only possibility to rule the air.

I personally prefer Polish one, only looses F&F (on the MRAAM) in exchange for 15pt, an additional veterancy step and +800m MRAAM range and generally if I feel the need to send a bait in front of it I use MIG-21 Lazur, especially vs things like Rafale, Eurofighter, Su-27. Usually I start with a Lazur / L-17K to have something against helo openings which can also act as low level ASF

If I want two MRAAM ASFs I go for MIG-23, Czechoslovak (2 at elite!) or DDR.

James-Bond wrote:Also on the subject on 15 man teams.
what your thoughts on "Komandosi" I like them
- Only REDFOR 15 man Special Forces
- AKS-74U (Carbine)
- 35pts (all SF 15 man teams are this price) other 15 man rifle squads are 25/30pts

I know the AP(15) on the AT weapon is terrible, but atleast it has 875m Range
(correct me if im wrong here)
I think most wheel transport is max 2 armour, which only takes 1 hit to destroy.
Then even the tough IFVs with 5 Front Armour die in 2 shots?
Now Tanks can be trouble, but not impossible.
one time I stumbled across a M1A2 in a forest, with 2x Komandosi, i made both squads go around the tank in different directions, so the tank had to turn to face one of the squads, managed to destroy it with a shot to the rear.

note: if there was ever a Komandosi 90' with updated AT weapon (Vampyr or RPG-26) I'd be extremely happy.


If I remember well, they were nerfed at some point, they used to be better. Obviously one doesn't take them for anti-tank duty and obviously with some micro you can overcome this weakness.

However, EB can spam very good shock infantry (MotSchutzen/Vyskadari/Spado) or 90s shock infantry at very efficient cost and with a large variety of transports so I don't think Kommandosi are really needed.

Adarius wrote:Current air tab is:

2 Mig-29 9-135
1 Su-25K
1 Su-22M4 Serla
2 SU 22M4p

But very open to change.


For tactical 10v10, since you micro a lot, this might work. For a general deck to be played in smaller games you want those ATGM planes to be downveted.

As for other choices, look at Su-22M4 (DDR) for an additional ATGM plane. I am not convinced at all by Su-25K, the plane is really nice but missiles are less powerful and I feel you overpay. (28 AP vs 30 AP). I think Seria and Su-22M4 upvetted can do nice things vs super heavies if you want to retain two ATGM planes.

Also if you consider to go with 2 upvetted ATGM planes it would be good to make room for a 5th card to pick a bomber as EB have very nice ones such as MIG-25 bomb truck, MIG-29 with ODABs (Nplm + HE), Su-22M4 with 2x1000 kgs HE. In small games I like Su-7BM.

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Re: RedFor, Eastern Block, National Decks (+ few other questions)

Postby Adarius » Thu 25 May 2017 15:41

steppewolf wrote:For tactical 10v10, since you micro a lot, this might work. For a general deck to be played in smaller games you want those ATGM planes to be downveted.

As for other choices, look at Su-22M4 (DDR) for an additional ATGM plane. I am not convinced at all by Su-25K, the plane is really nice but missiles are less powerful and I feel you overpay. (28 AP vs 30 AP). I think Seria and Su-22M4 upvetted can do nice things vs super heavies if you want to retain two ATGM planes.

Also if you consider to go with 2 upvetted ATGM planes it would be good to make room for a 5th card to pick a bomber as EB have very nice ones such as MIG-25 bomb truck, MIG-29 with ODABs (Nplm + HE), Su-22M4 with 2x1000 kgs HE. In small games I like Su-7BM.


My tactical decks are completely separate from these decks. I plan to use it for 1 vs 1 up to 3 vs 3. Will try 2 Serlas and a bomber instead to see what I think of them even if progress will be slow in the next few weeks.

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Re: RedFor, Eastern Block, National Decks (+ few other questions)

Postby Adarius » Sun 23 Jul 2017 20:18

This is my new General deck for anyone interested.

Image

General structure of the deck:

HQ: Jeeps are obvious and the infantry HQ allow me to drop off some fairly resilient infantry in my starting zone and use the helicopter to stun lock enemies in the opening.

Infantry: I've been struggling with the infantry tab as I feel that it tend to lose any major infantry grind in a forest. Motoschutze got a fair punch and Motoschutze 90 also pack a serious punch against any tanks. After careful consideration I also added Nebieski Beret which are 15 HP and come with higher veterancy than the Moto Schutzen. A lot of people dislike 15 HP as they get panicked and useless before the extra HP become valuable. Personally I find them useful as they allow me to keep combat contact with enemies and wipe them out with supporting units. LSTR-40 are just brilliant for early grabs and Konkurs-M are the top end ATGM.

Support: Probably my favourite tab. The Strop-2 is brilliant for openers, the Newa provide back-end support and the Fla-kom is the intermediate unit. With the New a single hit is enough as long as the Strop- LSTR-40 or Fla-Kom manages to land a hit. The Ondavas are also really nice for artillery support and the Mortar is probably my least favourite unit but important for smoking.

Tanks: 4 Super heavy tanks with supporting ATGM carriers, not much to say.

Recon: Should probably drop one of them for vehicle recon but got a hard time justifying the removal of one of them. The Salamander is useful for cleaning out flanks, Kampfschwimmer can hide anywhere. Pruszuminicki are very cheap and the Specialki Jednot are useful for attacking the enemy spawn or flanks.

Vehicle: The Pram-S is a rather odd unit but incredibly useful with its 2650 m cannon with 5 HE and long range ATGM. It is also amphibious so I constantly use it to remove enemy infantry or flank enemy tank attacks which can score one hit kills on the side armour of their tanks.

Helicopter: DHS-Mi24AP is very useful for anti-helicopter duty and almost necessary versus Israel who tend to make a mess out of my Strop-2 as they outrange them.

Plane: Fairly obvious and useful mid to high-range ASF, SEAD and Anti tank. I am however unsure on if the MiG-25RBF is worth it as it cannot defend itself and I struggle to find suitable targets that are exposed to HE damage but are worth enough points to justify the MiG with a pretty bad range for its bombs.

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Re: RedFor, Eastern Block, National Decks (+ few other questions)

Postby steppewolf » Tue 25 Jul 2017 14:06

Depends for what is your deck, I assume is destruction.

Adarius wrote:Infantry: I've been struggling with the infantry tab as I feel that it tend to lose any major infantry grind in a forest. Motoschutze got a fair punch and Motoschutze 90 also pack a serious punch against any tanks. After careful consideration I also added Nebieski Beret which are 15 HP and come with higher veterancy than the Moto Schutzen. A lot of people dislike 15 HP as they get panicked and useless before the extra HP become valuable. Personally I find them useful as they allow me to keep combat contact with enemies and wipe them out with supporting units. LSTR-40 are just brilliant for early grabs and Konkurs-M are the top end ATGM.


I still think Nebirskie are too costly. ATGM is fine but you should consider bringing them in wheeled transport or even in those Mi-17s, depending on your approach. Lstr are a must. MotSchutzen I prefer in BMP-2 (without ATGM) and MT-LBs.

Adarius wrote:Support: Probably my favourite tab. The Strop-2 is brilliant for openers, the Newa provide back-end support and the Fla-kom is the intermediate unit. With the New a single hit is enough as long as the Strop- LSTR-40 or Fla-Kom manages to land a hit. The Ondavas are also really nice for artillery support and the Mortar is probably my least favourite unit but important for smoking.


You also have the Osa for openings so why not use one of these two slots for a cheaper or more versatile unit like Tor or Sopel? Especially Tor if you have problems with Israelis Nimrods.

Adarius wrote:Tanks: 4 Super heavy tanks with supporting ATGM carriers, not much to say.


NSWP GLATGMs are quite weak compared with Soviet ones, I wouldn't waste two cards on them. One is enough as the main use in a non-armored deck is as a deterrent to long distance rather than tank killer, you can scare the opponent with them but rarely kill something and you do have other ATGMs with range (Konkurs-M in inf tab, Pram-S and you can take Czech top IFV for more Konkurs-M), you can spam that missile. Therefore keep the Dyna as I observed you like it a lot and I suggest to get a cheap but very cost effective tank like Merida or some of the Wilks, 85 pts one is damn cost effective . Best t55 (Merida), fantastic t72 wilks, 6 super heavies that are solid, what else? Dyna seems to me

Adarius wrote:Recon: Should probably drop one of them for vehicle recon but got a hard time justifying the removal of one of them. The Salamander is useful for cleaning out flanks, Kampfschwimmer can hide anywhere. Pruszuminicki are very cheap and the Specialki Jednot are useful for attacking the enemy spawn or flanks.


You are missing Snezka, excellent auto-cannon cheap vehicle to be spammed around the map. If you have Ondavas, makes sense to have spotters behind enemy lines which is probably the best role for Kamps so why don't you bring them in Mi-24? Have Specialy as your elite infantry in wheels, Pruszuminicki to spread around and the helo which is not very cost effective but I understand why you picked it. SpeziakAufk in SPW-40 may bring two recons at the price of one but I'd pick the Snezka.

Adarius wrote:Vehicle: The Pram-S is a rather odd unit but incredibly useful with its 2650 m cannon with 5 HE and long range ATGM. It is also amphibious so I constantly use it to remove enemy infantry or flank enemy tank attacks which can score one hit kills on the side armour of their tanks.


excellent ambusher, ZSU-57-2 or SPW-152E are good FSVs in close quarters.

Adarius wrote:Helicopter: DHS-Mi24AP is very useful for anti-helicopter duty and almost necessary versus Israel who tend to make a mess out of my Strop-2 as they outrange them.


I feel both DDR helos is a bit redundant. Use it as a scavanger, just go for the easy picks and use it as a deterrent but it is too costly to go head to head vs Celtics in air openings. I also like Sokols and Mi-35s but I don't play much with helos.

Adarius wrote:Plane: Fairly obvious and useful mid to high-range ASF, SEAD and Anti tank. I am however unsure on if the MiG-25RBF is worth it as it cannot defend itself and I struggle to find suitable targets that are exposed to HE damage but are worth enough points to justify the MiG with a pretty bad range for its bombs.


If you don't like Mig-25 than you have plenty of good bombers in NSWP decks such as Czech Mig-29s , only plane with thermobarics from game, Polish Su-7 BKL, Su-22M4 with 2 x 1000 kgs bombs. In small games I sometime use Su-7BM or L-39ZA

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Re: RedFor, Eastern Block, National Decks (+ few other questions)

Postby Adarius » Thu 27 Jul 2017 01:21

steppewolf wrote: I still think Nebirskie are too costly. ATGM is fine but you should consider bringing them in wheeled transport or even in those Mi-17s, depending on your approach. Lstr are a must. MotSchutzen I prefer in BMP-2 (without ATGM) and MT-LBs.

I will try the Motoschutze 90 in BMP-2s again. So far I've struggled with my IFV usage. Also I must say that the Nebirske have been performing very well so far. 700m rpg and 15 hp cause a lot of trouble in skirmishes.

steppewolf wrote:You also have the Osa for openings so why not use one of these two slots for a cheaper or more versatile unit like Tor or Sopel? Especially Tor if you have problems with Israelis Nimrods.

Not quite sure o what you mean here. The Strop-2 is excellent and only having 3 Newas means I come up short versus aircraft. The AA helicopter + Strop-2 + LSTR is good vs helicopters and New+Osa covers the planes.

steppewolf wrote:NSWP GLATGMs are quite weak compared with Soviet ones, I wouldn't waste two cards on them. One is enough as the main use in a non-armored deck is as a deterrent to long distance rather than tank killer, you can scare the opponent with them but rarely kill something and you do have other ATGMs with range (Konkurs-M in inf tab, Pram-S and you can take Czech top IFV for more Konkurs-M), you can spam that missile. Therefore keep the Dyna as I observed you like it a lot and I suggest to get a cheap but very cost effective tank like Merida or some of the Wilks, 85 pts one is damn cost effective . Best t55 (Merida), fantastic t72 wilks, 6 super heavies that are solid, what else? Dyna seems to me


I am not quite sure on why you dislike the ATGM tanks.

The 85 pts Wilks got 10 % less stabiliser, is 10 km/h slower but got 9 instead of 8 rounds per minute and one more in side armour compared to the 90 pts T-72MIM. Basically I trade a small amount of fire power when stationary and 5 pts for a high-end 2625 m ranged ATGM.


The Merida is a bit more challenging in my opinion as I pay 15 pts to get extra armour (13/10/3/3 instead of 10/4/2/2) but a weaker cannon (10 %) accuracy and a 2800 m ATGM. What I will try now is to live without the DDR helicopter with rocket pods and a slightly weaker recon tab to instead get the Merida in addition to the Dyna.

Adarius wrote:You are missing Snezka, excellent auto-cannon cheap vehicle to be spammed around the map. If you have Ondavas, makes sense to have spotters behind enemy lines which is probably the best role for Kamps so why don't you bring them in Mi-24? Have Specialy as your elite infantry in wheels, Pruszuminicki to spread around and the helo which is not very cost effective but I understand why you picked it. SpeziakAufk in SPW-40 may bring two recons at the price of one but I'd pick the Snezka.


The Salamanders and recon in helicopter have been a let down so far. My usage of the SPW-40 was due to its good optics but I will tyr the MI-24a to see if it fits with their better role and also drop the other helicopter infantry to make space for the Merida.

steppewolf wrote:
If you don't like Mig-25 than you have plenty of good bombers in NSWP decks such as Czech Mig-29s , only plane with thermobarics from game, Polish Su-7 BKL, Su-22M4 with 2 x 1000 kgs bombs. In small games I sometime use Su-7BM or L-39ZA


The Czech Mig-29s look very nice with 40 ECM so I will try it,

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