So, is the Dev team still on this game?

User avatar
Hob_Gadling
Captain
Posts: 1621
Joined: Tue 14 Feb 2012 00:15
Contact:

Re: So, is the Dev team still on this game?

Postby Hob_Gadling » Mon 12 Sep 2016 23:40

admiralzeech wrote:For me, I think I just have to accept that Eugen aren't the developers for me.


I think I have to accept the same thing, and I'm pretty much the exact opposite from you. I don't want RTS games, I want slow (some would say tedious) RTT games with heavy emphasis on realism on all levels. I can deal with terrible UI and sparse support as long as the game feels right.

Unfortunately for us both Eugen made potentially the best RTT since Close Combat 2 and then threw it all away because they wanted it to be more RTS-like. Then they made Act of Aggression which wasn't very good because they're not very good at making a tight, balanced RTS gaming experience. Now I'm left wondering what the hell they're going to do next, or what they even should do.

Oh well. Shame this one didn't pan out.

User avatar
McNash
Lieutenant
Posts: 1182
Joined: Sun 15 Apr 2012 18:06
Contact:

Re: So, is the Dev team still on this game?

Postby McNash » Tue 13 Sep 2016 17:24

Hob_Gadling wrote:
admiralzeech wrote:For me, I think I just have to accept that Eugen aren't the developers for me.


I think I have to accept the same thing, and I'm pretty much the exact opposite from you. I don't want RTS games, I want slow (some would say tedious) RTT games with heavy emphasis on realism on all levels. I can deal with terrible UI and sparse support as long as the game feels right.

Unfortunately for us both Eugen made potentially the best RTT since Close Combat 2 and then threw it all away because they wanted it to be more RTS-like. Then they made Act of Aggression which wasn't very good because they're not very good at making a tight, balanced RTS gaming experience. Now I'm left wondering what the hell they're going to do next, or what they even should do.

Oh well. Shame this one didn't pan out.


More Wargame DLC :D
Image

User avatar
fox_the_apprentice
Sergeant Major
Posts: 288
Joined: Wed 10 Dec 2014 23:50
Location: 127.0.0.1
Contact:

Re: So, is the Dev team still on this game?

Postby fox_the_apprentice » Wed 14 Sep 2016 18:59

McNash wrote:
More Wargame DLC :D


+1 :)

User avatar
varis
Brigadier
Posts: 3210
Joined: Mon 20 Feb 2012 16:52
Location: Finland
Contact:

Re: So, is the Dev team still on this game?

Postby varis » Sat 17 Sep 2016 03:42

Hob_Gadling wrote:Then they made Act of Aggression which wasn't very good because they're not very good at making a tight, balanced RTS gaming experience. Now I'm left wondering what the hell they're going to do next, or what they even should do.


I wonder if Eugen is/was wondering the same - ie. what to do, besides the obvious WarGame 4. They obviously want to do something else but then it's selecting something from the million different options, and figuring out what really fits to Eugen's brand and competitive advantage, while the huge WarGame brand is looming over you all the time.
Image

schaefsky
Sergeant Major
Posts: 270
Joined: Tue 9 Apr 2013 14:54
Contact:

Re: So, is the Dev team still on this game?

Postby schaefsky » Sat 17 Sep 2016 16:32

McNash wrote:it's a bit like what happened with ARMA, people don't really play Wargame because they want some sort of competitive eSports platform to fight for the top 10 in the ladder, but because that game fulfills the lifetime dream of a visually realistic real time tactics game were you can test virtually every iconic conventional killing machine built during the Cold War, at battalion level, Eugen Systems hit the nail, and I am totally convinced not even them knew what they were doing aside from trying to do something they liked (it's obvious the company executive officers are huge fans of the military too).

This so much. I still shake my head how Eugen or Focus seem to not have grasped why Wargame was a success (seem because I have no idea why they made the decissions they made but IMO AoA was the totally wrong direction to take, also this might be my personal taste).
IMO Wargame was a success because it offered something that is not available elsewhere, Cold War gone hot setting in a RTS with more than decent graphics. Now they tried to go down the C&C route with AoA, there is a lot more competition and not much demand from customers nowadays down this road.

While I have to salute them for still supplying free DLC to WRD:
Hob_Gadling wrote:I don't want RTS games, I want slow (some would say tedious) RTT games with heavy emphasis on realism on all levels. I can deal with terrible UI and sparse support as long as the game feels right.

Unfortunately for us both Eugen made potentially the best RTT since Close Combat 2 and then threw it all away because they wanted it to be more RTS-like. Then they made Act of Aggression which wasn't very good because they're not very good at making a tight, balanced RTS gaming experience. Now I'm left wondering what the hell they're going to do next, or what they even should do.

Oh well. Shame this one didn't pan out.

Personally I love to play single player campaigns, the only reason I got into MP with WEE was because I played through the campaign. I enjoyed MP, but SP is where it is at for me. Might also have something to do with me having not much spare time for games as I get older, in SP I can play at the pace that I like and can save and resume when it suits me.

As to what they should do next IMO it is painfully obvious:
Continue where they stopped with WEE (and WALB to a extend) and let us play a comprehensive Cold War gone hot in all of europe! WEE campaigns always felt like little skirmishes and stopped when it promised to get interesting.
Full blown (conventional) battles between NATO and WARPAC, set in different time frames (maybe as (payable) DLCs to keep things manageable), this is where Eugens market is at.
I know some people like the way AoA seems to be more, but there are other companies catering for that and I think success of Wargame vs AoA should show Eugen where their future should be.

Until that day I will keep dreaming, or hope another developer will make such a somewhat niche game with a decent demand for it nonetheless.

User avatar
Hob_Gadling
Captain
Posts: 1621
Joined: Tue 14 Feb 2012 00:15
Contact:

Re: So, is the Dev team still on this game?

Postby Hob_Gadling » Sun 18 Sep 2016 22:19

schaefsky wrote:Continue where they stopped with WEE (and WALB to a extend) and let us play a comprehensive Cold War gone hot in all of europe!


I agree with this.

Full blown (conventional) battles between NATO and WARPAC, set in different time frames (maybe as (payable) DLCs to keep things manageable), this is where Eugens market is at.


But I really disagree with this. ALB had the best campaign format at release and it was patched to oblivion in a few weeks. People didn't understand how the game should have been played and tried to play it like Total War (ie. everything attacks everything else all the time). As a result all the nice bits of game rules went to waste. A tutorial which spells out key points of campaign mechanics is needed more than anything, or building a great wargame will go to waste once more.

I'm also wary of whatever "full blown" means. In my experience it means "more stuff" which is usually not as good as less, better thought out stuff. For example, Close Combat 2 had the best grand campaign of any CC game ever. Adding more stuff into the campaign actually made it a worse game. One of the strong points of Eugen seem to be that they've really got the knack of simplifying the right parts. I'd like to see more of that in their future games, instead of a poor mans Total War.

Until that day I will keep dreaming, or hope another developer will make such a somewhat niche game with a decent demand for it nonetheless.


You and me both.

It's been 20 years since Steel Panthers 2 came out and that game is still the definitive Cold War tactics game. Eugen could beat that if they wanted to. I've no idea why they don't want to. People loved the elements that were lifted directly out of SP2. Why try to make a RTS out of something that would be loved as a RTT?

torinus
Lieutenant
Posts: 1239
Joined: Fri 15 May 2015 22:39
Contact:

Re: So, is the Dev team still on this game?

Postby torinus » Mon 19 Sep 2016 16:27

schaefsky wrote:
McNash wrote:it's a bit like what happened with ARMA, people don't really play Wargame because they want some sort of competitive eSports platform to fight for the top 10 in the ladder, but because that game fulfills the lifetime dream of a visually realistic real time tactics game were you can test virtually every iconic conventional killing machine built during the Cold War, at battalion level, Eugen Systems hit the nail, and I am totally convinced not even them knew what they were doing aside from trying to do something they liked (it's obvious the company executive officers are huge fans of the military too).

This so much. I still shake my head how Eugen or Focus seem to not have grasped why Wargame was a success (seem because I have no idea why they made the decissions they made but IMO AoA was the totally wrong direction to take, also this might be my personal taste).
IMO Wargame was a success because it offered something that is not available elsewhere, Cold War gone hot setting in a RTS with more than decent graphics. Now they tried to go down the C&C route with AoA, there is a lot more competition and not much demand from customers nowadays down this road.

There it not a lot of competition, there is ZERO competition. There is only SC2 and Planetary Annihilation, both fairly different than C&C.

What they tried is to use a Wargame engine for a different type of RTS and then release a slow, boring, unbalanced and on top of that a buggy game. Then they had almost zero PR presence anywhere and almost no support for the community.

The result is expected, a middling game that middling effort was put into.

User avatar
McNash
Lieutenant
Posts: 1182
Joined: Sun 15 Apr 2012 18:06
Contact:

Re: So, is the Dev team still on this game?

Postby McNash » Tue 20 Sep 2016 05:36

torinus wrote:What they tried is to use a Wargame engine for a different type of RTS and then release a slow, boring, unbalanced and on top of that a buggy game. Then they had almost zero PR presence anywhere and almost no support for the community.

The result is expected, a middling game that middling effort was put into.


Well yes, it's obvious they committed the same mistake EA did with C&C back in 2008, trying to turn AoA into a RTTesque videogame because "micromanagement" and "eSport", indeed, sometimes the right question is not "why you don't want this game" but "why do you play this game", also, ramming in an Age of Empire economy system which was supposed to make the game less predictable yet only annoyed potential fans and then the lack of marketing, although this is endemic from most Focus Home Interactive productions.

Ultimately Reboot edition tried to take out all the unnecessary elements like obnoxious upgrade requirements, over-complex economy and certain units abuse, but it was too little too late.
Image

User avatar
Holy_crap
Second-Lieutenant
Posts: 979
Joined: Fri 26 Oct 2012 21:25
Location: Putsie Capital Planet
Contact:

Re: So, is the Dev team still on this game?

Postby Holy_crap » Mon 26 Sep 2016 06:29

So, is the Dev team still on this game?

No
Leader of the glorious Putsie Federation. Saucer 1st Class.
Image
Steam - Tactical Tile Placement

User avatar
McNash
Lieutenant
Posts: 1182
Joined: Sun 15 Apr 2012 18:06
Contact:

Re: So, is the Dev team still on this game?

Postby McNash » Mon 26 Sep 2016 17:59

By the way, any word in the modding department?

One of the things we desperately need is step-by-step tutorials, I already posted some related to changing the colors of the factions and adding more money to the banks, but so far I haven't had any luck when it comes to stuff like editing textures, changing the rate of income or the unit stats, while I know some people has had the skill to dissect the data files the lack of step-by-step documentation and having to use Wargame tools to edit this game has been hindering my attempts to mod this thing.
Image

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests