The maps....

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Mister Maf
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Re: The maps....

Postby Mister Maf » Thu 18 May 2017 23:26

Mitchverr wrote:
MeetYaMaster wrote:Are we going to get any unique looking maps, ones that aren't just endless fields and tress with a few doted towns? I suppose Mont Ormel got some hills going for it but how about some rivers and bridges or some cliffs? Looking forward to release though :D


These are maps of the literal combat grounds of Normandy using RAF recce pictures. Simply put, this is what Normandy looks like lol.

This. The topography is pretty similar from map to map but it's really cool to consider that these maps are based on the real thing, and gameplay-wise they're all pretty different so far. They all have areas where each division can shine, which is fantastic. Too often in WRD maps would heavily favor either armor or infantry decks at the extreme expense of the other, but that's for the most part not the case in this game with what we've seen so far.
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Re: The maps....

Postby Saavedra » Fri 19 May 2017 00:18

Fade2Gray wrote:Pray tell, out of the maps that were played regularly, which have "lots of open ground" then? RD is all about making your own cover with smoke.

RD basically has a "lot of cover" in concentrated areas and insane amounts of open ground, though some (Highway for example) do go back to that EE style.


I did not play EE multiplayer too much, that is true. But I played both EE and ALB campaigns, and a whole lot of RD both multiplayer and campaigns, and I am 100% sure you will see way more open ground on EE and ALB than on RD. You said RD is all about "making your own cover with smoke", but that´s not because of having a ton of open terrain: that´s because you can hide 1995 MBTs behind a shrubbery and one-shot anything that comes your way. The ground is so not open that you will often use MBTs instead of missile launchers because those launchers tend to reveal themselves, get one-shot or spooked by said MBTs, and miss their shot, because cover features are so close to each other that you cannot make use of the missile launchers´ range in a ton of maps. And that´s assuming the MBT does not decide to simply close the distance thanks to its speed.

Of course, this is all assuming you do not count small hedges as terrain-closing features, which they are not because, unlike in SD, they do not block LOS.

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Re: The maps....

Postby Fade2Gray » Fri 19 May 2017 00:40

Saavedra wrote:snip


I don't know why you keep trying to go off on a tangent about super heavies. It's not what I'm discussing, period. The thread title even is "The maps..." so stop trying to sidetrack the discussion for reasons.

WGRD has 2 kinds of maps (and a few niches where its solid): Maze where it's insane amounts of cover and a total infantry grind fest, and maps like Hop where's cover is a token feature. There's some in between, though sadly if you take Bloody as an example? The cover is so concealed that it makes it obvious where you need to nuke with arty in team games.
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Re: The maps....

Postby Saavedra » Fri 19 May 2017 01:35

Fade2Gray wrote:I don't know why you keep trying to go off on a tangent about super heavies. It's not what I'm discussing, period. The thread title even is "The maps..." so stop trying to sidetrack the discussion for reasons.

WGRD has 2 kinds of maps (and a few niches where its solid): Maze where it's insane amounts of cover and a total infantry grind fest, and maps like Hop where's cover is a token feature. There's some in between, though sadly if you take Bloody as an example? The cover is so concealed that it makes it obvious where you need to nuke with arty in team games.


First of all, you are the one that started comparing the maps in SD to those in Wargame. Second, I was telling you I did not see how WGEE had maps with tons of cover when they were fairly open compared to WGRD. Third, I did point out twice that we did not have the same situation here with tanks as we had in WGRD... and for a very good reason: nothing shows the difference between these maps as well as the fact that tanks here do not dominate the battlefield.

Thanks to all the LOS blocking, AT guns being capable of creeping through hedges, and infantry not teleporting through cities anymore, the maps are vastly improved: all units have their use without being completely eclipsed by units of a different tab, no matter the map, and combined arms is way more of a thing.

Assuming German players can stop spamming Nebelwerfers...

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Re: The maps....

Postby TankHunter » Fri 19 May 2017 06:01

wargamer1985 wrote:I feel, at least personally, that the maps we have a very much a return to EE, with some important facilities on the map and other interesting landscapes (industrial facilities, airfields etc.). This is not a bad thing by any stretch, and I am grateful to see the return.


I have to agree. Carpiquet gives serious EE vibes. Loved the airfield map(s?) in EE. Having actual military facilities on the maps is a nice touch.
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Re: The maps....

Postby Fade2Gray » Fri 19 May 2017 08:06

Saavedra wrote:snip again


I honestly don't even. As such, moving on...

TankHunter wrote:
wargamer1985 wrote:I feel, at least personally, that the maps we have a very much a return to EE, with some important facilities on the map and other interesting landscapes (industrial facilities, airfields etc.). This is not a bad thing by any stretch, and I am grateful to see the return.


I have to agree. Carpiquet gives serious EE vibes. Loved the airfield map(s?) in EE. Having actual military facilities on the maps is a nice touch.


That was one of the top maps, so many places to bound and leap from made it something special. The overall EE feel of the maps in SDN is kinda tempting me to take the plunge and buy it.

Still lastly that the BRO got overlooked, but eh, maybe I'll get into modding and see if I can tweak things to make 2ID into 1ID in appearances.
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Re: The maps....

Postby Mako » Sat 20 May 2017 01:00

No problems with the maps in general, though I profoundly dislike the two newest maps Carpiquet et Odon, they're extremes.

First is the "german armor with the biggest guns and most kruppstahl murder everything in a salt flat" and the second is "horrible vietnam WWI meatgrinder of arty and infantry blobs dying to arty"
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Re: The maps....

Postby TankHunter » Sun 21 May 2017 01:03

Mako wrote:No problems with the maps in general, though I profoundly dislike the two newest maps Carpiquet et Odon, they're extremes.

First is the "german armor with the biggest guns and most kruppstahl murder everything in a salt flat" and the second is "horrible vietnam WWI meatgrinder of arty and infantry blobs dying to arty"


Carpiquet is doable for the Allies. You can win the fight for the towns and airfield buildings, and then do an AT gun/TD crawl up the airfield proper using the plentiful light cover and air power/arty. You can't just YOLO it with tanks(unless you're 3rd AD with a good idea of where the enemy is hiding AT), you need a combined arms approach. Holding the 2 sides of the airfield allows you to make it a killing zone with AT guns on the sides, even if you can't really hold down the open ground.

I'll have to agree on Odon. It's a real meatgrinder. I decided to play my first game as 12th SS on that map. It didn't go horribly but I was nearly out of infantry by the end. You really need to make special decks for that map, bringing as many actual infantry/sapper squads as you can(leaders are important, but in this case not as important as real combat squads which you'll be burning through) + the more heavily armed Scouts/Pathfinders/Spaetrupp,etc as opposed to 2 man recon squads. Definitely a bad map for armored divisions, not because their infantry is bad(Armored Rifles and Pgrens are pretty good, Arm. Rifles especially so in close combat on Odon thanks to tons of semi-autos.) but because it's so fucking expensive and they can't get the bodies out fast enough. They also can't utilize vehicles to effectively support their infantry at all. Definitely a map where armored divisions are bottom tier.
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