#MakeAmericaGreatAgain

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StalkerDellaNote
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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby StalkerDellaNote » Mon 7 May 2018 15:53

Vulcan 607 wrote:
My question for Trump then is how come with all these mass shootings a civilian with a gun has yet to stop one?

I can't buy that "need more guns" bullshit, but a majority of the mass shootings don't tend to happen in gun friendly states, you'll notice hardly anything happens in states like Texas and Utah vs California or New York.. Not to say gun violence never happens in those states, it just ironically happens a lot more in the states that are most strict..
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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Bougnas » Mon 7 May 2018 20:37

StalkerDellaNote wrote:
Vulcan 607 wrote:
My question for Trump then is how come with all these mass shootings a civilian with a gun has yet to stop one?

I can't buy that "need more guns" bullshit, but a majority of the mass shootings don't tend to happen in gun friendly states, you'll notice hardly anything happens in states like Texas and Utah vs California or New York.. Not to say gun violence never happens in those states, it just ironically happens a lot more in the states that are most strict..



French here so that's a question from someone that is ignorant about the subject but: Are gun friendly states inhabitants maybe more responsible with guns and more careful towards potential murderers? By having such a gun culture, aren't they somewhat better prepared than stricter states?

I don't know if the comparison works but I believe that Switzerland is also quite gun friendly but since people are trained to handle guns and mad people they seem less affected (relatively speaking obviously).
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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Vulcan 607 » Mon 7 May 2018 22:29

Bougnas wrote:
StalkerDellaNote wrote:
Vulcan 607 wrote:
My question for Trump then is how come with all these mass shootings a civilian with a gun has yet to stop one?

I can't buy that "need more guns" bullshit, but a majority of the mass shootings don't tend to happen in gun friendly states, you'll notice hardly anything happens in states like Texas and Utah vs California or New York.. Not to say gun violence never happens in those states, it just ironically happens a lot more in the states that are most strict..



French here so that's a question from someone that is ignorant about the subject but: Are gun friendly states inhabitants maybe more responsible with guns and more careful towards potential murderers? By having such a gun culture, aren't they somewhat better prepared than stricter states?

I don't know if the comparison works but I believe that Switzerland is also quite gun friendly but since people are trained to handle guns and mad people they seem less affected (relatively speaking obviously).


I think that helps but the American attitude to guns is so much different from Europe's its a right not a privilege (which I believe is totally wrong), I also believe Europe has better mental health care.

I will add I believe the U.S. need tighter background checks and mental health checks before a firearm is purchased, though it requires it to be enforced for example the shooter at Dunblane was a well know paedophile who got in trouble with the police repeatedly for taking photos of boys swimming. why the Scottish firearms licensing decided it would be ok for him to have handguns is anyone's guess but their incompetence got a bunch of kids killed and pistols banned on the UK mainland. So there it is background checks are great but only if they are actually performed.

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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Mike » Tue 8 May 2018 01:02

Doinize wrote:
Mike wrote:
Vulcan 607 wrote:
My question for Trump then is how come with all these mass shootings a civilian with a gun has yet to stop one?


One did at a church in Texas about a year ago.

Thats a pretty bad record seeing as you seem to have one of those like twice a week...


He asked for one. I gave him one.

Vulcan 607 wrote:
Mike wrote:
Vulcan 607 wrote:
My question for Trump then is how come with all these mass shootings a civilian with a gun has yet to stop one?


One did at a church in Texas about a year ago.


But the shooting had already happened


Then here are more. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/vol ... 2f8b67474c
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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Killertomato » Tue 8 May 2018 06:14

StalkerDellaNote wrote:
Vulcan 607 wrote:
My question for Trump then is how come with all these mass shootings a civilian with a gun has yet to stop one?

I can't buy that "need more guns" bullshit, but a majority of the mass shootings don't tend to happen in gun friendly states, you'll notice hardly anything happens in states like Texas and Utah vs California or New York.. Not to say gun violence never happens in those states, it just ironically happens a lot more in the states that are most strict..


CO and FL are pretty damn gun-friendly. So's TX, where the church shooting happened, and Virginia was when Virginia Tech happened.

In other news, Ollie North is the president of the NRA! We're living in a shitty satirical novel from 1991.
orcbuster wrote:USSR gets prototype marsupials, why would you need moose when you got stuff with kickers like that AND transport capability? And I'm not even gonna START on the french Marsupilami, I don't even think thats a real animal! Why no trolls for Norway?

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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Vulcan 607 » Tue 8 May 2018 07:44

http://www.newsweek.com/navy-seals-seal ... ssion=true

If this is true SEAL team 6 really needs to look in the mirror

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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Grabbed_by_the_Spets » Tue 8 May 2018 11:06

Killertomato wrote:In other news, Ollie North is the president of the NRA! We're living in a shitty satirical novel from 1991.


Nothing better to help defend American values than someone who has literally committed high treason!



I still think it's better to just not have mass shootings...
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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby D-M » Tue 8 May 2018 15:23

Carrying a weapon doesn't prevent terror attacks indeed (nothing can really, beside having no terrorists but the threat of un/concealed carry is pretty meagre to someone determined to be a martyr) but police can only act so fast. Between the start of an attack and moment the police can effectively protect the citizentry, there got something that must be done and while having a bunch of armed citizen might be a risky move, I think we can do better than a random bunch of cow boys.
Maybe we (US, French, whatever) could go for some of militia armed citizen, trained, vetted and equipped by law enforcement agencies whom primary role would be to be to organize first response security, evacuation, information and basic coordination with the police.
It's still risky as there are a lot of details to be definied to avoid catastrophes : how do you recognize the armed citizen from the terrorist ? How can you be sure terrorists aren't posing as law abidding citizens ? How much trust should police put into the information they receive ? etc
A terror attack is confusing by essence, if the exact skills, priorities, responsibilities are not finely definied, it would just pile some more on top.
The real problem with Trump is not the idea itself but thinking it has something to do with gun control, it doesn't, at least not in the sense he is suggesting to the NRA. Having a bunch a cow boy in a crow and hope that one of them will activate Hero mode is nothing but wishful thinking what we need is talented and skilled individuals.

I'm not sure about the US but in France, policemen can ask to keep carrying their weapon off-duty, that's kind of the idea but it's clearly not enough.
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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Mike » Tue 8 May 2018 15:47

Grabbed_by_the_Spets wrote:


I still think it's better to just not have mass shootings...


And where in the fuck did I say mass shootings are great?
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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Killertomato » Tue 8 May 2018 16:00

D-M wrote:Maybe we (US, French, whatever) could go for some of militia armed citizen, trained, vetted and equipped by law enforcement agencies whom primary role would be to be to organize first response security, evacuation, information and basic coordination with the police.

I'm not sure about the US but in France, policemen can ask to keep carrying their weapon off-duty, that's kind of the idea but it's clearly not enough.


US Police can almost always carry off duty, and most do.

That 'militia' is, theoretically, what CCW training is supposed to give you, but of course one day of CCW training really isn't enough for that. In some states, you'd never get training like that through the legislature- they have constitutional carry, so there are no restrictions below the federal level.

So what we have is this weird hodgepodge of regulations. In some states, to carry concealed, you have to be rich and famous or under threat. In others you just have to cloud a pane of glass. I know SF guys who carry and people who shouldn't have bread knives that carry.
orcbuster wrote:USSR gets prototype marsupials, why would you need moose when you got stuff with kickers like that AND transport capability? And I'm not even gonna START on the french Marsupilami, I don't even think thats a real animal! Why no trolls for Norway?

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