#MakeAmericaGreatAgain

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another505
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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby another505 » Sun 28 Jan 2018 16:57

Vulcan 607 wrote:
another505 wrote:
Vulcan 607 wrote:So Turkey is threatening to attack US forces in Syria not the brightest idea

Except things are going his way since the crackdown. Theres no sanctions or retaliation other than not upgrading his leo2a4 but he can go to russia to start buying stuffs like the s400.
Usa and the west simply dont have enough stakes in it to care or resist and they are too busy with internal affairs. Operation olive branch shows that. And now Is the perfect time to attack with the momentum still going and the door of oppurtunity is still there. usa troops simply have to back out. Besides, if it does come to shove, turkish backed rebel could be doing the diry work against usa soldier while turk just give reconnaissance and continue the fight against kurs. Happened before with a small skirmish and hilariously russia had to come and stop it.


Turkish backed rebel forces won't last long against US, UK and French air support and if Turkish forces do directly attack US forces, well I can see Edrogen been trapped between a rock and a hard place. he can't be seen to back down but if he picks a fight with the U.S. they will wipe his forces out. I personally wouldn't be surprised to see another coup if he actually attacks the U.S. military this time backed by US forces.


you are only implying that US and the West will actually give the fight in the first place. By the trends of things, in my guess, they won't, there are no incentives and they haven't being do it Afrin. they can't even give a freaking sanction, there is no unified resistance against him then some politicians and newspaper yelling, and some protest.
is quite a political embarrassment that the rebels the west used to support against Assad are now shooting them. And even losing one USA/West soldier outweights losing 30 FSA rebels.
the turks could give artillery support to the rebel against USA soldier i suppose, which would help a lot, and if they get called out, Erdogan can simply call it a "mistake" and no one is going to do anything about it
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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Shrike » Sun 28 Jan 2018 18:54

Grabbed_by_the_Spets wrote:
Vulcan 607 wrote:Turkish backed rebel forces won't last long against US, UK and French air support and if Turkish forces do directly attack US forces, well I can see Edrogen been trapped between a rock and a hard place. he can't be seen to back down but if he picks a fight with the U.S. they will wipe his forces out. I personally wouldn't be surprised to see another coup if he actually attacks the U.S. military this time backed by US forces.


US has, and will, bend over backwards to accommodate Turkey, it has for them before, and it has with other key players in the ME *Cough*SAUDI*cough*.

I'm disappointed that Obama, Hillary, and the EU showed support for Erdogan during the coup and said they had to stand with him for democracy. This whole turning a blind eye to corruption and atrocities makes hard for me to take some people seriously. It reminds me of t hat period of time where the league of nations spent most of their time appeasing warmongering states while believing that they could maintain world peace. Erdogan probably doesn't care about being in NATO at this point and only has his own interests and agendas to follow. The Saudis definitely don't care about western values, yet continue to turn a blind eye what goes on there while we continue to preach how important Western and Liberal values are important.

As it stands there has been too much appeasement lately. Germany has blocked Ukraine and Georgia's invitations to NATO, not to mention a certain German foreign minister has some financial plans with Russia and has gone out of his way to try and appease Putin. At this point Putin is looking to make Russia be seen as relevant world power again with China beginning to enter the world stage as well.

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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Killertomato » Sun 28 Jan 2018 19:53

Shrike wrote:I'm disappointed that Obama, Hillary, and the EU showed support for Erdogan during the coup and said they had to stand with him for democracy.


There's no winning in that situation. Erdogan was democratically elected, the coup was enormously unpopular- we couldn't have worked against him without throwing the whole support of democracy thing out the window, and this isn't 1981.


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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby holoween » Mon 29 Jan 2018 06:16

Shrike wrote:As it stands there has been too much appeasement lately. Germany has blocked Ukraine and Georgia's invitations to NATO, not to mention a certain German foreign minister has some financial plans with Russia and has gone out of his way to try and appease Putin. At this point Putin is looking to make Russia be seen as relevant world power again with China beginning to enter the world stage as well.


yea how dare germany have an idependant foreign policy

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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Fade2Gray » Mon 29 Jan 2018 08:05

So the "No Lackin" challenge has finally resulted in someone getting shot...

in the face. The gangsta culture in this country is truly retarded.

another505 wrote:the turks could give artillery support to the rebel against USA soldier i suppose, which would help a lot, and if they get called out, Erdogan can simply call it a "mistake" and no one is going to do anything about it

That would be a huge mistake. If the Turks kill an American soldier, knowing Trump? There would be serious trouble. Trump knows his base is fanatical about service members, and he would probably take it as a serious insult.

Otherwise Erdogan could do just about anything.
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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Markenzwieback » Mon 29 Jan 2018 10:40

holoween wrote:
Shrike wrote:As it stands there has been too much appeasement lately. Germany has blocked Ukraine and Georgia's invitations to NATO, not to mention a certain German foreign minister has some financial plans with Russia and has gone out of his way to try and appease Putin. At this point Putin is looking to make Russia be seen as relevant world power again with China beginning to enter the world stage as well.


yea how dare germany have an idependant foreign policy

While I completely agree to your point with the independent foreign policy jab, the entire saber rattling nonsense considering smaller scale NATO exercises was pure stupidity coming from a a foreign minister, now president. Especially since the social democrats apparently forgot that Ostpolitik includes the diplomacy of words as well as the diplomacy of power; it has been like that in the 70s and still is today. But nowadays we simply don't have the latter and many tactfully ignore that power in the international system doesn't only derive from soft power.
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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby another505 » Mon 29 Jan 2018 18:34

Fade2Gray wrote:So the "No Lackin" challenge has finally resulted in someone getting shot...

in the face. The gangsta culture in this country is truly retarded.

another505 wrote:the turks could give artillery support to the rebel against USA soldier i suppose, which would help a lot, and if they get called out, Erdogan can simply call it a "mistake" and no one is going to do anything about it

That would be a huge mistake. If the Turks kill an American soldier, knowing Trump? There would be serious trouble. Trump knows his base is fanatical about service members, and he would probably take it as a serious insult.

Otherwise Erdogan could do just about anything.


True, i guess Erdogan could supply some mortars or whatever low grade typical middle east rebel artillery munitions like grad, at least to their rebels.
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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Doinize » Mon 29 Jan 2018 19:18

holoween wrote:
Shrike wrote:As it stands there has been too much appeasement lately. Germany has blocked Ukraine and Georgia's invitations to NATO, not to mention a certain German foreign minister has some financial plans with Russia and has gone out of his way to try and appease Putin. At this point Putin is looking to make Russia be seen as relevant world power again with China beginning to enter the world stage as well.


yea how dare germany have an idependant foreign policy


Yeah I mean in addition to that, Georgia and 404 land in NATO are just kind of a terrible idea...
They arent really what you would call stable and A+ ally material.

And Russia already feels cornered, adding further onto that is probably not the smartest move unless you are really into WW3... :^)
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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby Shrike » Mon 29 Jan 2018 22:29

Doinize wrote:
holoween wrote:
Shrike wrote:As it stands there has been too much appeasement lately. Germany has blocked Ukraine and Georgia's invitations to NATO, not to mention a certain German foreign minister has some financial plans with Russia and has gone out of his way to try and appease Putin. At this point Putin is looking to make Russia be seen as relevant world power again with China beginning to enter the world stage as well.


yea how dare germany have an idependant foreign policy


Yeah I mean in addition to that, Georgia and 404 land in NATO are just kind of a terrible idea...
They arent really what you would call stable and A+ ally material.

And Russia already feels cornered, adding further onto that is probably not the smartest move unless you are really into WW3... :^)

The allied powers didn't want WW2 to happen either and tried preventing it by letting Germany take Czechoslovakia and Japan take Manchuria without confrontation. Besides that, the Axis did a pretty good job at dividing the Allies and the Allies pacifism to their advantage by slowly annexing small countries like Austria, Albania, Czechoslovakia, etc. You also see them creating puppet states like Croatia, Manchukuo, and making alliances with countries still bitter towards the Allies like Hungary and Bulgaria. There were also some other attempts by the Axis to influence other nations into making them more sympathetic towards them. Like in the US you had Fascist movements like the Silver shirts, and pro-nazi groups like the American-German Bund.

Interestingly enough you can draw some parallels between then and now with some influences from the Cold War such as proxy wars. Russian Influence probably goes much farther and deeper than Trump and the Republicans alone. Perhaps Russian is influencing both groups like ANTIFA and the alt-right to destabilize the USA and keep attention off Russia on the global stage. You also have the west's big economies and trade deals/organizations like TTP, NATFA, and the EU. With Trump wanting to pull out of NATFA/TPP and Eastern European countries wanting to pull out of the EU I imagine other countries would start looking for other nations to trade with. Which I am sure Russia would benefit greatly in trade with other nations, provided competing economies are weakened. Also while annexing countries is near impossible, its apparently possible to have many of your citizens leave the country and immigrate to neighboring countries and attempt a succession movement, kind of like the Mexican-American war and the Texas revolution. Kind of reminds me of this book.

Either way, the level of complacency and still clinging onto world outlooks from the 2000s have made us blind.

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Re: #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

Postby D-M » Tue 30 Jan 2018 00:49

And Russia already feels cornered, adding further onto that is probably not the smartest move unless you are really into WW3... :^)


Ah yes, the WW3 boogey man. :roll:
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