#Brexit vote coming soon.

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Shrike
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Re: #Brexit vote coming soon.

Postby Shrike » Wed 1 Jun 2016 19:05

orcbuster wrote:I've looked at the UK electoral system. Abusable does not do it justice.


Agreed.

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Re: #Brexit vote coming soon.

Postby Frencho » Wed 1 Jun 2016 19:56

Shrike wrote:
orcbuster wrote:I've looked at the UK electoral system. Abusable does not do it justice.


Agreed.


Putaing sont tarés ces rosbeefs!

I was aware their electoral system was crap, but I never bothered to look it up in depth. Never saw something explain it as concisely and clearly as this video, thanks for sharing this.

Well the US one is a bit less worse but it still reeks with great electors, superdelegates and what not. I'll watch his videos on those to make some sense out your unrepresentative and abusable mad anglo electoral systems.

And your (un)representatives then have the gall to go spread "democracy" throughout the world eh?!

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Re: #Brexit vote coming soon.

Postby Mitchverr » Wed 1 Jun 2016 20:07

Frencho wrote:And your (un)representatives then have the gall to go spread "democracy" throughout the world eh?!


To be fair to the system, it wasnt so bad untill the recent elections, prior to this it kept the government from having infighting while also generally being representative of the popular vote, its recent years with many parties taking votes which has shown the serious errors in the system.
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Re: #Brexit vote coming soon.

Postby Frencho » Wed 1 Jun 2016 20:11

Mitchverr wrote:
Frencho wrote:And your (un)representatives then have the gall to go spread "democracy" throughout the world eh?!


To be fair to the system, it wasnt so bad untill the recent elections, prior to this it kept the government from having infighting while also generally being representative of the popular vote, its recent years with many parties taking votes which has shown the serious errors in the system.


So this abomination of a system is to prevent hung parliaments and the need for ruling coalitions?
I would prefer a hung parliament to my vote counting for naught and some nobody with 12% of the vote getting elected.

So how is the EU any less unrepresentative or less democratic than your own electoral system?

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Mitchverr
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Re: #Brexit vote coming soon.

Postby Mitchverr » Wed 1 Jun 2016 20:26

Frencho wrote:
Mitchverr wrote:
Frencho wrote:And your (un)representatives then have the gall to go spread "democracy" throughout the world eh?!


To be fair to the system, it wasnt so bad untill the recent elections, prior to this it kept the government from having infighting while also generally being representative of the popular vote, its recent years with many parties taking votes which has shown the serious errors in the system.


So this abomination of a system is to prevent hung parliaments and the need for ruling coalitions?
I would prefer a hung parliament to my vote counting for naught and some nobody with 12% of the vote getting elected.

So how is the EU any less unrepresentative or less democratic than your own electoral system?



With our system, the people we vote into office can put forward motions for new laws or to remove and alter older 1s, not so much the case with the EU parliament, thats a key difference, along with the laws in the UK being in totallity under public scrutiny and having to pass by elected officials, this is not the case within the EU government where to many can be passed without a single MEP even having a say in on the matter.

And before when it was for the most part a 2 or 3 party system it was alright because in those situations you need an opposition to keep tabs on the leading party, but now we have several parties it no longer works hense why i said i want a new system a bit like how the MEPs are chosen.
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Re: #Brexit vote coming soon.

Postby varis » Wed 1 Jun 2016 20:39

Always down with them antidemocratic capitalists of course!

If Britain votes more than 50% Yes, does that mean they will try and leave EU? I mean if they can somehow negotiate that with the rest of us (but they have nukes and so) because I don't think there was any provision for countries leaving in the various treaties we've signed along the way.

It'd probably be as unconstitutional as Finland joining way back with over 50% popular vote, whereas 2/3 majority would have been required in the parliament and they still voted Yes over there back in the day. But it's a nice way to use the media circus to circumvent parliamentary democracy. (Insert mention of the anti-democratic globalized ultra-capitalist elites here.)

Considering all the benefits of economic integration and so on, I'd think it's a bad move though. Is there a nice summary about all the arguments for leaving somewhere, btw? TTIP of course sounds fishy but it's just one small piece in what all the EU is about.
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Re: #Brexit vote coming soon.

Postby Mitchverr » Wed 1 Jun 2016 21:09

If the majority vote to leave we will leave, the government promised this to us, no renegotiations, this is a key point of the manifesto, if they dont do it they will risk not having a majority in government and risk a vote of no confidence or even the queen herself slapping the commons into election (this is 1 of the few times she is supposed to do this btw as her job). Right now with how they have been, a new labour victory is very possible so they wont risk it as they wont be in office next time as they just lied to half those whom actively vote lol.

As for lists, its a pain to find a legit list, if i post 1 it will be called biased....

http://uk.businessinsider.com/reasons-w ... ea-2015-10

Has some decent points but bias is there too.... Sadly its all biased today... It also misses out that Turkey is looking more and more likely to join the EU, if they come in then its another reason i would want out, the EU is going nutty.
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Re: #Brexit vote coming soon.

Postby LoneRifle » Wed 1 Jun 2016 21:33

Absolute majority decisions on stuff like this are a bad idea.

2/3rds at least.
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Re: #Brexit vote coming soon.

Postby Bullfrog » Wed 1 Jun 2016 21:47

Killertomato wrote:It amuses me that so many support this no matter what every economist/scientist/etc says about it.


It's not exclusively an economic issue, I've seen people make the argument that the real issue for Britain is overpopulation and migration. Not only from the Middle east but from continental Europe.
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Frencho
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Re: #Brexit vote coming soon.

Postby Frencho » Wed 1 Jun 2016 23:34

Killertomato wrote:It amuses me that so many support this no matter what every economist/scientist/etc says about it.

I guess you guys need your own Trump.


Donald Trump to visit UK on day of EU referendum result

"Trump has often weighed in on the referendum, and believes the UK should leave the EU. He told Fox News in May: “I know Great Britain very well. I know the country very well. I have a lot of investments there. I would say that they’re better off without it. But I want them to make their own decision.” He recently told Hollywood Reporter, “Oh yeah, I think they should leave”, after being initially unfamiliar with the term “Brexit”."

They don't need their own trumperino, if they they leave the EU Trump will promise them to become the 51st State once elected!

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