War movies.

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DeuZerre
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Re: War movies.

Postby DeuZerre » Fri 25 May 2012 20:58

Huh... Raising doors? Really? Nice engineering there :roll:

In all logic, in that kind of situation, surely you would like doors that go down to be certain they stay in place, that if the electronics are down there is a mean to let them down manually, and we'll see later to go out?
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ikalugin
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Re: War movies.

Postby ikalugin » Fri 25 May 2012 21:31

DeuZerre wrote:Huh... Raising doors? Really? Nice engineering there :roll:

In all logic, in that kind of situation, surely you would like doors that go down to be certain they stay in place, that if the electronics are down there is a mean to let them down manually, and we'll see later to go out?

You would see that the door is pulled up by the counterweights.

Also the tunnel is round in shape, so the door coming from below makes sense (as the passenger area takes the top half of the round tunnel)
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DeuZerre
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Re: War movies.

Postby DeuZerre » Sat 26 May 2012 01:23

It still seems like a weakness to me; It's easier to keep a "door" shut if is down, and i believe the idea is to keep it shut. If the counterweights system breaks...
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Re: War movies.

Postby ikalugin » Sat 26 May 2012 01:43

DeuZerre wrote:It still seems like a weakness to me; It's easier to keep a "door" shut if is down, and i believe the idea is to keep it shut. If the counterweights system breaks...

The point is that there isn't much space above the entryway due to the round shape of the tunnel. The walkway is within the upper half of the tunnel tube, in order to have it come from above you would need to weaken the tunnel roof which is a bad idea, or to build a large room above the blast door.

When the door is shut it is blocked in place with locks, so when it is shut it wont open by itself unless locks are disengaged. You also want to be able to open the door afterwards without external power (as after the attack there is much smaller chance of having power, than before the attack)

The counter weight system is as reliable as any mechanical system and is unlikely to go wrong in the peace time (when the door gets closed). No one would close it after the blast.

Thus the system is fine, we also have the variants with side rolling door and a hinged variant.
That said there are also auxiliary airlocks to supplement the primary entry/exit facility so you would not expect to open the main door (which would require to disengage the locks) anyway.
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We need more missilez code for the missilez god.
Praslovan:
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Re: War movies.

Postby DeuZerre » Sat 26 May 2012 02:01

Ayup. Valid points.
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Re: War movies.

Postby ikalugin » Sat 26 May 2012 02:39

DeuZerre wrote:Ayup. Valid points.

Well Moscow system is quite extensive.

In addition to the primary (Metro) system and individual shelters within the city boundaries (fallout shelters for individual factories and such, old command and control systems) you have the D6/Metro2 system (which is connecting the older government relocation sites and command and control sites, such as RVSN command post and the PVO command post) and it extends to the outside of immediate Moscow area.

You also have lesser command/control/relocation structures in the regions and new primary command/relocation area built in Urals in the post cold war environment.

Basically even with the shift to conventional warfare in the 80s and the end of the cold war in the 90s we have continued the construction of such structures. In fact even when we lacked money for the basic troops training we continued with such building programs.
And somebody questions human survival in all out nuclear war...
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Spoiler : :
We need more missilez code for the missilez god.
Praslovan:
"Tactical Ikalugin inbound on this position in 10... 9..."
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Re: War movies.

Postby Romiros » Sat 26 May 2012 05:22

ikalugin wrote:
DeuZerre wrote:Ayup. Valid points.

Well Moscow system is quite extensive.

In addition to the primary (Metro) system and individual shelters within the city boundaries (fallout shelters for individual factories and such, old command and control systems) you have the D6/Metro2 system (which is connecting the older government relocation sites and command and control sites, such as RVSN command post and the PVO command post) and it extends to the outside of immediate Moscow area.

You also have lesser command/control/relocation structures in the regions and new primary command/relocation area built in Urals in the post cold war environment.

Basically even with the shift to conventional warfare in the 80s and the end of the cold war in the 90s we have continued the construction of such structures. In fact even when we lacked money for the basic troops training we continued with such building programs.
And somebody questions human survival in all out nuclear war...

And don't forget, that commieblocks much more tough than ordinary West buildings.

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Re: War movies.

Postby ikalugin » Sat 26 May 2012 05:27

Romiros wrote:
ikalugin wrote:
DeuZerre wrote:Ayup. Valid points.

Well Moscow system is quite extensive.

In addition to the primary (Metro) system and individual shelters within the city boundaries (fallout shelters for individual factories and such, old command and control systems) you have the D6/Metro2 system (which is connecting the older government relocation sites and command and control sites, such as RVSN command post and the PVO command post) and it extends to the outside of immediate Moscow area.

You also have lesser command/control/relocation structures in the regions and new primary command/relocation area built in Urals in the post cold war environment.

Basically even with the shift to conventional warfare in the 80s and the end of the cold war in the 90s we have continued the construction of such structures. In fact even when we lacked money for the basic troops training we continued with such building programs.
And somebody questions human survival in all out nuclear war...

And don't forget, that commieblocks much more tough than ordinary West buildings.

You mean the panel houses? They arent really great in the blast environment due to the large side area, which would lead to their completely demolished by the single blast, while in smaller buildings it is not a such an issue.
In case of older (stalinist) buildings you get bomb shelters and sturdier structure.
Image
Spoiler : :
We need more missilez code for the missilez god.
Praslovan:
"Tactical Ikalugin inbound on this position in 10... 9..."
Image

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Romiros
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Re: War movies.

Postby Romiros » Sat 26 May 2012 05:31

ikalugin wrote:
Romiros wrote:And don't forget, that commieblocks much more tough than ordinary West buildings.

You mean the panel houses? They arent really great in the blast environment due to the large side area, which would lead to their completely demolished by the single blast, while in smaller buildings it is not a such an issue.
In case of older (stalinist) buildings you get bomb shelters and sturdier structure.

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ikalugin
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Re: War movies.

Postby ikalugin » Sat 26 May 2012 06:20

Those building were made of monolithic pre stressed reinforced concrete and bricks.

Also none of them were over the height of 7 stories - generic of a russian panel apartment buildings.
Basically they are really not great for anything, nuclear attack and heat insulation included.

They are also more vulnerable to a much greater threat - that of a firestorm, due to difficulty of evacuation.
Image
Spoiler : :
We need more missilez code for the missilez god.
Praslovan:
"Tactical Ikalugin inbound on this position in 10... 9..."
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