Wargame Team League - Qualification Season

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untilted
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Re: Wargame Team League - Qualification Season

Postby untilted » Sun 20 Jan 2013 22:53

Shifu wrote:Long story short: PLF has adhered to the word of the rules but not the sportsmanship spirit

please elaborate.

if you're at that, maybe there's a way to fit the fact that a teamleader plays in two different teams into such a concept of "sportsmanship".
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noDestiny
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Re: Wargame Team League - Qualification Season

Postby noDestiny » Sun 20 Jan 2013 23:11

untilted wrote:please elaborate.

if you're at that, maybe there's a way to fit the fact that a teamleader plays in two different teams into such a concept of "sportsmanship".


The only reason for this is, that WTF? had a activity-problem and need some players. Walkyre asked me, if one member of NoUnit can help him and i said yes. You can see this as a other kind of sportmanship...
I dont know any other incidents like this...and i also think it isn't unfair.

To prevent such problems in the next season there will be some new rules, but i can't introduce new rules while a running season...

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Re: Wargame Team League - Qualification Season

Postby enohka » Sun 20 Jan 2013 23:25

Shifu wrote:@El Bubba: Maybe we can play on Tuesday? Or next weekend? Let's get in contact via steam ^^

Regarding that situation between PLF and The Beasts:
Calm down guys, it's just a game - as far as I understood the issue: nodestiny must have missed the fact that there is the minimum sectors-to-capture - okay, errare humanum est - anyway, PLF has used this to win the game within 2 minutes (what I heard of rumors by using Nato's advantage of fast helicopters - no chance for pact then), but they abode the rules as far as possible - by using the the setting nearest to the rules.
Long story short: PLF has adhered to the word of the rules but not the sportsmanship spirit - what about making a "best-of-three"?
That would show sportsmanship while on the same time PLF would get their victory honored, just a suggestion by an old man :)


Yes, they were using Lynx.AH7 and Blackhawks with 350 km/h. With that rules there were _NO_ chance for us to win this as pact, really it was impossible. They abused this weak ruleset with best knowing. Its a lack of sportsmanship and i can not show sympathy to this childish reactions here of PLF.

But to show sportsmanship we would agree playing a best of 3 with this "win" counting for PLF.

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untilted
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Re: Wargame Team League - Qualification Season

Postby untilted » Sun 20 Jan 2013 23:28

noDestiny wrote:The only reason for this is, that WTF? had a activity-problem and need some players. Walkyre asked me, if one member of NoUnit can help him and i said yes. You can see this as a other kind of sportmanship...
I dont know any other incidents like this...and i also think it isn't unfair.


i guess that NU member would be General Binks.

enohka is teamleader for beasts - he played on atleast two occassions for WTF?.
Last edited by untilted on Sun 20 Jan 2013 23:34, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Wargame Team League - Qualification Season

Postby varis » Sun 20 Jan 2013 23:28

enohka wrote:
[DAY]Topspin2005 wrote:There has to be a win for PLF ... because settings are not possible and they do it as close as they could. So please be fair Team BEAST and confirm the win ;) THX !


Its not us whos showing a lack of sportmanship here, they are. They abused unplayable rules. Take care of your own problems. Thanks.


I take this as a rather serious accusation against a clan that is well-known for its long-lasting show of sportsmanship. Could you please elaborate on two points:

1) How exactly did an "abuse of unplayable rules" put your team at a disadvantage? (Ok, based on Enohka's statement on lynx and blackhawk, I will discuss this with a representative of the team.)

2) If the rules are unplayable, why did your team not make this an issue before you a) joined the league b) agreed to play the game?
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Re: Wargame Team League - Qualification Season

Postby enohka » Sun 20 Jan 2013 23:29

enohka wrote:
Shifu wrote:@El Bubba: Maybe we can play on Tuesday? Or next weekend? Let's get in contact via steam ^^

Regarding that situation between PLF and The Beasts:
Calm down guys, it's just a game - as far as I understood the issue: nodestiny must have missed the fact that there is the minimum sectors-to-capture - okay, errare humanum est - anyway, PLF has used this to win the game within 2 minutes (what I heard of rumors by using Nato's advantage of fast helicopters - no chance for pact then), but they abode the rules as far as possible - by using the the setting nearest to the rules.
Long story short: PLF has adhered to the word of the rules but not the sportsmanship spirit - what about making a "best-of-three"?
That would show sportsmanship while on the same time PLF would get their victory honored, just a suggestion by an old man :)


Yes, they were using Lynx.AH7 and Blackhawks with 350 km/h. With that rules there were _NO_ chance for us to win this as pact, really it was impossible. They abused this weak ruleset with best knowing. Its a lack of sportsmanship and i can not show sympathy to this childish reactions here of PLF.

But to show sportsmanship we would agree playing a best of 3 with this "win" counting for PLF.



This WTF? thing: Beast is a standalone team. I was Beast member long before I joined WTF?. It has NO link to WTF?.

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Re: Wargame Team League - Qualification Season

Postby enohka » Sun 20 Jan 2013 23:41

varis wrote:I take this as a rather serious accusation against a clan that is well-known for its long-lasting show of sportsmanship.


Its not an accusation, in this case its a fact.

varis wrote:Could you please elaborate on two points:

1) How exactly did an "abuse of unplayable rules" put your team at a disadvantage? (Ok, based on Enohka's statement on lynx and blackhawk, I will discuss this with a representative of the team.)


As we all know, the NATO has the faster Infantry carrier helicopters. On the pact side, we had no possible chance to stop them from capturing the amout of sectors required to win. The rule said (for this map) to use the minimum required circles. Not a single shot was fired in this game. No unit died.

varis wrote:2) If the rules are unplayable, why did your team not make this an issue before you a) joined the league b) agreed to play the game?


I'm new to this game. I barely played conquest. First thing was, I didnt even know what maps are included since they were hosting the game and there is no list of conquest maps provided anywhere. I asked for the maps but didnt receive an answer. I said nothing more because i wanted to keep an friendly environment. I never expected such a fiendishly move.

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untilted
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Re: Wargame Team League - Qualification Season

Postby untilted » Sun 20 Jan 2013 23:48

enohka wrote:I'm new to this game. I barely played conquest. First thing was, I didnt even know what maps are included since they were hosting the game and there is no list of conquest maps provided anywhere. I asked for the maps but didnt receive an answer. I said nothing more because i wanted to keep an friendly environment. I never expected such a fiendishly move.

please can you explain me then how the vetoing of game-modes went?

if it happened according to the rules PLF had the first veto on game mode, and beast the second one. so why did your team chose conquest over destruction/economy if you barely played it?
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Re: Wargame Team League - Qualification Season

Postby Shifu » Sun 20 Jan 2013 23:55

untilted wrote:
Shifu wrote:Long story short: PLF has adhered to the word of the rules but not the sportsmanship spirit

please elaborate.

if you're at that, maybe there's a way to fit the fact that a teamleader plays in two different teams into such a concept of "sportsmanship".

Well, maybe I used the wrong words to express this ... as I know you're capable of german: Ähnlich wie bei der Radbruchschen Formel war meine Intention: Man soll lieber dem Sinn, dem "Geist", der Gesetze folgen als dem genauen Wortlaut. Ein Richter hat sich daher auch - der Radbruchschen Formel zufolge - für die Gerechtigkeit und gegen den das Gesetz im Falle besonderer Ungerechtigkeit zu entscheiden.
For our english speaker: It's not always good to follow the rules/laws word by word, but may be better to follow their spirit, their intention - and I doubt that nodestiny's intention was to allow such games, though - as said - you have actually not infringed the rules. So, technically, it's a win, but I think the point discussed here is ethically side. I'm sorry if my words have been mistakable.

Additionally, as the thing of "exchanging" players have been arisen, I would consider these two issues separately. And I'm tired for the moment, I'll go on this issue tomorrow (maybe start a new topic for that, it'll be a looooooong post :p) - a little hint: go to bed guys, you won't save the world by going further today :) (you must have to follow my words, because that's post number 666! ^^

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Re: Wargame Team League - Qualification Season

Postby enohka » Sun 20 Jan 2013 23:55

untilted wrote:please can you explain me then how the vetoing of game-modes went?

if it happened according to the rules PLF had the first veto on game mode, and beast the second one. so why did your team chose conquest over destruction/economy if you barely played it?



easy thing: I didnt know that this is not winnable, because I never played conquest on this map. But we have chosen Conquest because we are Highly skilled agressive players - good premise to play conquest under normal conditions, what do you think?

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