Need atgm advice, counter heavy pact tanks

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Need atgm advice, counter heavy pact tanks

Postby Orange » Thu 19 Apr 2012 20:54

I like to play nato. Since some time I see the pact heavy tanks getting used very much and I came to a point of frustration where I believe that Nato got nothing to counter T80 series and T64BV. Nato atgms are all utter crap or I am incredibly unlucky. The Jaguar 2 shot 4 atgms with none hitting. the Vab mephisto doesnt hit at all even with vet2. The bradley acc10 did hit a few times but doesnt live long enough to do anything. The marder atgm are poor. The helo atgm would be cool if the enemy wouldnt always have a bunch of missile AA with his tanks making them totally useless. Nato tanks are all crap due to lack of atgm.

I believe that Nato atgms need a serious buff. At least in accuracy, It cant be that pact tanks atgms outperform nato specialised atgm vehicles by far. I got extremely frustrated when my french tank with acc10 wouldnt hit a damn while standing still and a T72 with acc4 hit while moving -.- I upoad a replay about this where I made a test. For this I sat in the wood and let them come. Bad for wining the game I know but good for looking how the atgms perform.

I once used atgm infantry but I find them so incredibly useless that I stopped to. They dont hit and the enemy shoots at them they get stunned or die very fast. Also with the buratino any Nato defense is useless. I am at a point where i do not know anymore how to counter a force of 2T80U 4 T64xx 1buratino 3strop2. Such a combo seems like an instant win. And 2 players teaming up attacking from 2 sides is not an equal counter.

I am Nero in the game.

BTW I read a real life news about the T90. It said that 1 T90 is as much worth as 10 Leo2 because its atgm would have damaged or destroyed them before getting into shooting range. Will look if I can find that news article again.
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Re: Need advice, counter T80

Postby DeuZerre » Thu 19 Apr 2012 21:03

Try the MILAN F2: A side hit on a T-80 and it's toast. Of course, you have to draw enemy's attention away from the ATGMs for this to be effective. Also consider buying 1 level of experience with NATO infantry ATGMs.

If anti-air coverage is weak, try an cobra. Stunning with rockets is fun.

Many things to try out. Basically, turn of the ATGMs, attack with a distraction force on the side of their formation, then open fire as they don't face your hidden ATGMs. Once the high value targets are out, go at him before he fires a new volley of Buratino.
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Re: Need atgm advice, counter heavy pact tanks

Postby Orange » Thu 19 Apr 2012 21:33

So when I complain about atgms with acc10 not hitting you suggest me using Milan with acc5? Well with high veterancy this could be interesting. Will test. Still I think I need an atgm with higher AP power than 10 or the moment they face the tank frontal they become very weak.
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Re: Need atgm advice, counter heavy pact tanks

Postby DeuZerre » Thu 19 Apr 2012 21:35

Actually, the ones on vehicles are slightly bugged.

The thing is, with infantry carried ones, the enemy approaches closer before spotting them, so you actually hit more.

ATGMs at max range tend to miss a lot.
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Re: Need atgm advice, counter heavy pact tanks

Postby Xeno426 » Thu 19 Apr 2012 23:39

Orange wrote:So when I complain about atgms with acc10 not hitting you suggest me using Milan with acc5? Well with high veterancy this could be interesting. Will test. Still I think I need an atgm with higher AP power than 10 or the moment they face the tank frontal they become very weak.

MILAN F2 has accuracy 6...
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Re: Need atgm advice, counter heavy pact tanks

Postby iwancoppa » Fri 20 Apr 2012 00:03

as a pact player i am struggling to grasp your problem -

Leo2's, Challs and Abrams all seem to rip my t80's

My only suggestion would be to tell your tanks to attack the AA and get helis in to stunlock the t80's. then its just a matter of getting your spammy tanks to whittle them down. try taking a few leo2a4's with your spamtanks.
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Re: Need atgm advice, counter heavy pact tanks

Postby Orange » Fri 20 Apr 2012 00:11

Fine! then its the other Milan atgm having acc5 as if that 1 more acc would help it against pact tank onslaught. Still stuff like a T72xx still got atgm acc8 AP11. Which is sick OP. Its like a leo2 mixed with a shturm and 800km range for 120 surpassing all nato tanks. Realism aside, Pact tanks should not have accuracy above 5 and ap9 with their atgms, everything else just breaks the game for Nato. Either that or make mortars more deadly to kill the AA.

The fact alone that you cannot go toe on toe with pact tanks and need to flank into their side armor (t72xx side armor5 still really strong) shows how nasty it is for Nato players.

@iwancoppa really? Right now if 3 leo2 meet 3 T72 (best russian version) the atgms alone kill 1 or seriously damage 2 of them before the leo2 can get into firing range. British tanks are pathetic with their 40kmh I bet the pact tanks can fire 2 volleys with atgms at them. Any pact tank atgm laughs at Abrams with front armor 9. To mass weak tank gun units also doesnt really work with their poor ap power and really they just feed the buratino in the back. About AA you cannot kill it without arty. Sniping doesnt work with a wall of atgm tanks between you and them.
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Re: Need atgm advice, counter heavy pact tanks

Postby D-M » Fri 20 Apr 2012 01:56

HOW TO WIN WITH TANKS AND/OR AGAINST TANKS

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ts;du: Put some space between your units, make a front line larger than 2.4 km, 2.6 km to be sure. Manoeuver >>> Technology
Last edited by D-M on Fri 20 Apr 2012 02:00, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Need atgm advice, counter heavy pact tanks

Postby Operator » Fri 20 Apr 2012 01:59

Orange wrote:Nato got nothing to counter T80 series and T64BV. The Jaguar 2 shot 4 atgms with none hitting.

I think, Leo1a1 would be enough to counter T-64BV. Just aim it's side armor. No one will trade 130pts unit on crap army. MT-LB Shturm-S disappoints me almost everytime when it shots, because it's hit rate is very low too. 10/11 would be fair for it's 55pts. Remember, Jaguar2 for 60pts has superior stats.
On the topic: just use Leo2/M1A1 with Jaguar2s on the flanks. Your opponent will think twice before attack. At least, I have problems with this mix.

Orange wrote:I believe that Nato atgms need a serious buff. At least in accuracy <...>

Nope. NATO have at least three vehicles with 10/11ATGM, while the best PACT ATGM is 9/11. New tank balance seriously limited ATGM usage especially for PACT (as PACT have more ATGM units). ATGMs are balanced now for both sides.
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Re: Need atgm advice, counter heavy pact tanks

Postby CompositeGNFNR » Fri 20 Apr 2012 02:04

Personally as a CCCP PACT player i'm using less and less ATGM on my T-80Us and such due to the range increase of Heavy tanks, I've been seeing lots of Leopard 2A4s which can simply engage my units before the ATGM hits them. If i threw in some BMPs ATGM may be viable but for tanks I am finding the main cannon to be just as good.

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