Campaign scenarios you want?

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Re: Campaign scenarios you want?

Postby Tank Spammer » Sat 15 Feb 2014 19:11

jonas165 wrote:
T80U = tankbankai wrote:To end the West German involvement in Asia discussion, it is plausible that NATO and pact restrict the main war to the east and have limited military operations in Europe meaning that the west Germans might send a battlegroup to help out due to the limited warfare on the European front.


At the very first, West Germany had about the same restrictions as Japan had after World War 2. There was (or still is) in article in the constitution which says, that Germany´s Army may only act in case of defence. So this makes not much sense. There would have to be some sort of attack on Germany. But there are/were no German colonies, close allies (like the US and Japan) or special interests in Asia. So it´s kind of doubtful that there will be a realistic reason to include Germany in the Campaigns, but I am sure Eugen will make something interessting up :D


Yes, but then again UK/France don't have much reason to be in either. Although they had small colonies, none of those were going to hold enough troops to fight a full fledged war in Asia. Forget about top of the line armor divisions with Leclerc and Challenger II!

From that respect W. Germany is rather ok.

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Re: Campaign scenarios you want?

Postby jonas165 » Sat 15 Feb 2014 19:35

Tank Spammer wrote:
jonas165 wrote:
T80U = tankbankai wrote:To end the West German involvement in Asia discussion, it is plausible that NATO and pact restrict the main war to the east and have limited military operations in Europe meaning that the west Germans might send a battlegroup to help out due to the limited warfare on the European front.


At the very first, West Germany had about the same restrictions as Japan had after World War 2. There was (or still is) in article in the constitution which says, that Germany´s Army may only act in case of defence. So this makes not much sense. There would have to be some sort of attack on Germany. But there are/were no German colonies, close allies (like the US and Japan) or special interests in Asia. So it´s kind of doubtful that there will be a realistic reason to include Germany in the Campaigns, but I am sure Eugen will make something interessting up :D


Yes, but then again UK/France don't have much reason to be in either. Although they had small colonies, none of those were going to hold enough troops to fight a full fledged war in Asia. Forget about top of the line armor divisions with Leclerc and Challenger II!

From that respect W. Germany is rather ok.


That´s more of a reason then no reason. And if you have read my post, you would know that Germany has a restriction based on it´s law, which UK and France don´t have. Of course, wargame is alternative hisotry and I am more then glad that Germany gets updated and might appear in the capaign, I just said it´s not really realistic.
And Challenger 2 isn´t even confirmed yet, while all other nations heavies are, among them Challenger 1 Mk.3. I doubt we will see it in RD. Oh man that would cause so much British whine....
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Re: Campaign scenarios you want?

Postby Flieger » Sat 15 Feb 2014 19:46

jonas165 wrote: Of course, wargame is alternative hisotry and I am more then glad that Germany gets updated and might appear in the capaign, I just said it´s not really realistic.


It all depends on the scenario. There were out of area deployments of Bundeswehr units during the Cold War (even if these were no combat missions), and self defense or foederis casus were viable reasons to deploy combat troops. When, for some reason, no invasion of W-Germany is imminent, a Bundeswehr battle group in Asia is thinkable and lawful. It is unlikely, but not entirely impossible.

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Re: Campaign scenarios you want?

Postby another505 » Sat 15 Feb 2014 19:56

The government of w-germany is fallen to a new dictator, and they start taking colonies in the far east
USA feeling left out, starts taking over japan and south korea
french joins in and starts the 2nd vietnam war
australia invades new guinea and other oceanic islands
UK starts invading republic of ireland
USSR starts a full out amphibous invasion at scotland to gain more colonies too, and invades the scandinavians while at it
Canada has been secretly recruiting an insane army
cut out alaska oil supply to usa, and invades washington DC and sabotage usa nuclear weaponary in day one
China invades mongolia to takes what back what is hers
India and pakistan starts fighting again
North korea gets invaded by china


South america and africa suddenly disappears from the map, and no one noticed :D

just making things up lol
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Re: Campaign scenarios you want?

Postby Kovlovsky » Sat 15 Feb 2014 19:58

I doubt that the Bundeswehr would be send in Asia to protect a mere embassy, even if the embassy ground is considered to be german soil by the international law. I'm pretty sure that the impossibility to deploy the Bundeswehr abroad was applied with the restrictive interpretation. What would make more sense would be to send an anti-terrorist unit to resolve an hostage crisis by example. But an armored brigade? It seems unlikely.
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Re: Campaign scenarios you want?

Postby Hydrashok » Sat 15 Feb 2014 20:25

West Germany is a member of NATO. Upon any attack on a member nation (US in Japan or South Korea, UK in Hong Kong, France in Vietnam...) NATO invokes article 5 of the NATO charter which considers any attack on a NATO member as an attack on all NATO members. Freed from the restriction of acting in defense only and definitely concerned with other countries upholding article 5 if they were ever attacked, West Germany sends a token taskforce to Asia.

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Re: Campaign scenarios you want?

Postby TheD3rp » Sat 15 Feb 2014 20:29

Debt of Honor

USA vs Japan

Based on the Tom Clancy novel

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Re: Campaign scenarios you want?

Postby Kovlovsky » Sat 15 Feb 2014 20:35

Hydrashok wrote:West Germany is a member of NATO. Upon any attack on a member nation (US in Japan or South Korea, UK in Hong Kong, France in Vietnam...) NATO invokes article 5 of the NATO charter which considers any attack on a NATO member as an attack on all NATO members. Freed from the restriction of acting in defense only and definitely concerned with other countries upholding article 5 if they were ever attacked, West Germany sends a token taskforce to Asia.


Yes, but they would be deployed against a soviet trust in Germany. I'm pretty sure they would only send non-combat units in an Asian theater. At that time, NATO was only thought as a defensive alliance against the Warsaw Pact. NATO didn't become an interventionist tool before 1991.
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Re: Campaign scenarios you want?

Postby Killertomato » Sat 15 Feb 2014 20:36

I cannot believe I didn't think of Debt of Honor myself.
orcbuster wrote:USSR gets prototype marsupials, why would you need moose when you got stuff with kickers like that AND transport capability? And I'm not even gonna START on the french Marsupilami, I don't even think thats a real animal! Why no trolls for Norway?

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Re: Campaign scenarios you want?

Postby Hydrashok » Sat 15 Feb 2014 20:39

Kovlovsky wrote:
Hydrashok wrote:West Germany is a member of NATO. Upon any attack on a member nation (US in Japan or South Korea, UK in Hong Kong, France in Vietnam...) NATO invokes article 5 of the NATO charter which considers any attack on a NATO member as an attack on all NATO members. Freed from the restriction of acting in defense only and definitely concerned with other countries upholding article 5 if they were ever attacked, West Germany sends a token taskforce to Asia.


Yes, but they would be deployed against a soviet trust in Germany. I'm pretty sure they would only send non-combat units in an Asian theater. At that time, NATO was only thought as a defensive alliance against the Warsaw Pact. NATO didn't become an interventionist tool before 1991.


I think because of the threat, and depending on how strong the attacking party urged, that West Germany could have been convinced to send armed forces to Asia. If, for example, the UK or US threatened to pull its troops out of West Germany or even worse not come to West Germany's defense that they could put enough pressure on West Germany to intervene with a token task force. After all, what is the loss of one armored battalion compared to the withdrawal of the entire UK contingent of forces in West Germany?

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