New version (v.48)

Bryan
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Re: New version (v.48)

Postby Bryan » Wed 2 Apr 2014 03:35

Strange....
I don't see the new maps, nor do I see any changes, but the version states 00048.
And now I get Access Violation when I close the game....

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elmoking
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Re: New version (v.48)

Postby elmoking » Wed 2 Apr 2014 03:36

Can we get exact data on aircraft changes?
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LazyDane
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Re: New version (v.48)

Postby LazyDane » Wed 2 Apr 2014 03:45

Stealth buff to clusters? Which is a good change.

I honestly don't think the downgrading from trained to rookie is that big of a deal, the trained bonuses given weren't that huge.

With that said, I really don't like how almost all planes are only one card - some nations rely on their over abundance of certain air units to help make up for other weaknesses, the East Germans with their MiG-29s, for example. It's going to make playing East Germany that much more off putting.

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trotskygrad
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Re: New version (v.48)

Postby trotskygrad » Wed 2 Apr 2014 03:46

LazyDane wrote:I honestly don't think the downgrading from trained to rookie is that big of a deal, the trained bonuses given weren't that huge.


it's a massive deal when it comes to stun resistance against missile hits.
NEXT TIME I SEE A DAMN FLAMEWAR INVOLVING DARTH-LAMPSHADE, FROSTPOOKY, LONERIFLE, FADE2GRAY, TROTSKYGRAD AND/OR ANYONE INVOLVED IN A DISCUSSION BETWEEN THEM I'M GOING TO HAND OUT BANS TO ANYONE USING ANYTHING LOOKING REMOTELY LIKE AN AD-HOMINEM

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Re: New version (v.48)

Postby LazyDane » Wed 2 Apr 2014 03:51

trotskygrad wrote:
LazyDane wrote:I honestly don't think the downgrading from trained to rookie is that big of a deal, the trained bonuses given weren't that huge.


it's a massive deal when it comes to stun resistance against missile hits.

They were as vulnerable before as they are now. Sure a Su-27 might have gotten off a missile or two if it were hit, but it'd still more than likely die.

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f4llout
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Re: New version (v.48)

Postby f4llout » Wed 2 Apr 2014 04:05

As much as I "despise" Eugen for screwing up the deck system ... the AIR change is not as apocalyptic as everyone talks about:
- they levelled the playing field for high-end ASF
- they made mid-range ASF useful and needed again
- even low tier fighters have their place now in openings and as bait

There might still be some unevenness in other departments but they will balance that later.
+ stop the frigging whine ... now you actually have to show some skill in air-battles instead of just circle jerking with top end ASF.
+ get some air kills and your fighters will level up above rookie (if you take them at that level)
+ while vet level does matter ... correct me if I'm wrong ... but the stun difference between rookie and trained is only 50% ... trained is not 3x better, since rookie is normal, ergo 100% stun. (MadMat/anyone could clarify this fact). Am I correct and is just the tooltip written badly?

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Re: New version (v.48)

Postby TinyMan07 » Wed 2 Apr 2014 04:28

as much as these changes are okay i still see gaps in the whole area of the air meta. the fact that Soviet airforces have more MRAAMs than nato countries frustrates me. let's say i'm playing a US deck. i have 2 ASFs with MRAAM missiles. so does the enemy. however, i ALSO have to deal with that guy's multiroles that have MRAAMs. what do i have on my multiroles? oh, sidewinders. okay then. my multiroles then proceed to get their rocked by fighters they should be on par with. if anything can we atleast re-arm the F-16C with wintip AIM-120s instead of sidewinders? i think that would be the best counter to jets like the MiG-29M
Last edited by OpusTheFowl on Wed 2 Apr 2014 18:41, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New version (v.48)

Postby shomu1 » Wed 2 Apr 2014 04:40

TinyMan07 wrote:as much as these changes are okay i still see gaps in the whole area of the air meta. the fact that Soviet airforces have more MRAAMs than nato countries frustrates me. let's say i'm playing a US deck. i have 2 ASFs with MRAAM missiles. so does the enemy. however, i ALSO have to deal with that guy's multiroles that have MRAAMs. what do i have on my multiroles? oh, sidewinders. okay then. my multiroles then proceed to get their rocked by fighters they should be on par with. if anything can we atleast re-arm the F-16C with wintip AIM-120s instead of sidewinders? i think that would be the best counter to jets like the MiG-29M



The main problem is the higher ECM on the top tier Soviet ASFs *cough* Su-27PU *cough*, which combined with the rookie veterancy and lower ECM of their US counterparts (F-15C, F-16 Block 52), actually gives the USSR air forces a slight edge, since the US missiles won't hit because of ECM, but the Russian ones will.

Of course, the fact that the Russians seem to have bolted R-77s to pretty much everything that can carry them doesn't really help either...

Yeah, Sidewinders on F-16s are nice for when you need to kill helos, but they're kind of pointless since you shouldn't be using an F-16C to kill helos. They're too fast and don't get the kill half the time. AMRAAMs would be much more useful. Sure they'd up the price, but I'm fine with having to pay 20 more points for a CBU jet if it means it gets home even if it got bounced by an Su-27. It would also make the loss of the dedicated ASFs much less crippling.
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Re: New version (v.48)

Postby Izo Azlion » Wed 2 Apr 2014 06:50

Not keen on the patch. You've ruined the Chally 2, which despite it's 4HE now (if you don't have enough support around your tanks to kill infantry, you're doing it wrong, especially with the British having the Lynx ah.7) not only got -2 damage but also got -1 armour, assuming the newly buffed Russian tanks are present.

After all the pissing and moaning on the forums, there has been very little change with anything people have put good points forwards for, but a lot of change in things that didn't really need it.

Super Heavy tanks are a prime example of this - 180 points for a single tank, which yes can open many tin cans. But as soon as the enemy see's these tanks, they are completely overwhelmed by either attack helos, or ATGM's, or planes. A 180 point tank is such good denial, that it's worth investing to destroy it, because a tank is only so good against so many targets, but a bombing aircraft can be reused to great effect.

There is a reason my tanks stat is less than 7% used - Because they are god-awful.

Secondly, for the love of christ, can we stop having odd numbers in infantry cards, please? 9 Paratroopers? 7 SAS? 9 US Marines? Everything is odd numbers. The deck creation where infantry is concerned is so restrictive at 5 cards that it leaves no room for creativity, but enforces absolutely critical unit use and that's it. By reducing the number of available cards, you're reducing the player's available creativity. Infantry are the backbone, and right now that bone is deformed.

I love the game but I don't feel free playing it at all. Loosen the grip on availability a little, and god knows the deck-specific bonus' need fixing somewhat too.

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Mitchverr
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Re: New version (v.48)

Postby Mitchverr » Wed 2 Apr 2014 07:00

Hopefully we will see the challenger 1 mk3's getting buffed up to rof 10 to compensate.

Maybe a plus 1 frontal armor for CR2, but i doubt that.

Also, the finally changed radar thing on the stormer, erm, can we also get it changed in terms of the guid tag to fit the rest of the AA systems aswell?
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