West Germany’s Bundeswehr in WRD

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urho
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Re: West Germany’s Bundeswehr in WRD

Postby urho » Tue 7 Oct 2014 12:53

awesomesauce47 wrote:@urho did you actually read my post?

If you don't think the marder 2 is op for 30 points I don't know what to tell you. I normally can kill super heavies at close range while being hard as hell to kill in forest fighting with the 10av.

Will not argue your point about the EF if you will fail to read and understand my argument.

MG3 is best mg in game, if you manage to get all 20 of your jäger by am sure-24M it is your fault. Roland 3 is more then enough.

>qq
suuuure
>Roland 3 solves it all
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Have you ever heard about SEAD?
And what exactly does a Roland 3 do against buratino?
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awesomesauce47
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Re: West Germany’s Bundeswehr in WRD

Postby awesomesauce47 » Tue 7 Oct 2014 13:04

Double post

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Re: West Germany’s Bundeswehr in WRD

Postby awesomesauce47 » Tue 7 Oct 2014 13:10

@urho keep ignoring the rest of the post bud, but I will bite anyways. Just turn off the radar, when non-sead plane comes, turn Radar on, profit. Easy as that bud. I manage just fine as eurocorps with Roland 3. I would suggest putting them in groups of 2, they are a lot more effective that way.

Not sure what you are trying to say about the buratino when 90% of the countries in game can't deal with it. It is a situational short range mlrs. Only way to kill it is suicide an agm plane when it is aiming (surprise surprise west Germany can do this) or kill it with arty (which is unlikely because it is a t-72). I personally don't even run up against the buratino all that often, but it isn't some super weapon that you can't counter or kill.
Last edited by awesomesauce47 on Tue 7 Oct 2014 13:15, edited 1 time in total.

Forimar
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Re: West Germany’s Bundeswehr in WRD

Postby Forimar » Tue 7 Oct 2014 13:10

To players who believe Eurocorps overall is too strong compared to all others in WRD, something which really is not what this topic is all about, I can only say: host national deck/battlegroup games and all your Eurocorps problems are solved. Other than that, I advise forum members to start a “Eurocorps in WRD” topic to specifically discuss that issue and not invade this topic with that discussion.

Why should all other coalitions be banned from a lobby just to deal with one being a bit too powerful? Like it or not, Eurocorps is a valid point because they can't just be willed away from existance. Any major buffs to Wger will also be felt when playing with or against the Euro deck.

Concerning a Bundeswehr Typhoon in WRD it is useful to show that having four top level Interceptors/ASFs in a deck/battlegroup is currently already possible in WRD. But it seems to not present any problems since there are no long running forum topics discussing such an issue.

No, it's not.
- 1 slot of 1 elite Su 27S at 150 points
- 1 slot of 1 elite Su 27 M at 200 points (unique multi-role case)

First isn't top level, second isn't an ASF. Try fighting Rafs or a Su27PU without SRAAMs.
- 1 slot of 1 elite F-16C Block 52 at 160 points
- 1 slot of 1 elite F-15A Eagle at 130 points

F16C is great but also technically not top level, F15... Sparrows, AIM9L and 30% ECM. Nuff said.
- 1 slot of 1 elite Tornado F.3 at 135 points
- 1 slot of 2 elite Tornado F.2 at 110 points

50% ECM and F&F or bust

A top level fighter needs 2 things to make it good, F&F MRAAMs and high ECM. If we go by your definition of top level fighters EC already has the best loadout in game with mirages+rafs+KWS.

I have never in hundreds of WRD multiplayer games seen any USSR, USA, UK or French player deploy four slots out of five with 100+ costing elite experience level Interceptors/ASFs. Why? Because Interceptors/ASFs do not decide ground combat and four aircraft slots can be better utilized with other air assets than only Interceptors/ASFs. Other air assets which can actually directly influence ground combat, which Interceptors/ASFs clearly cannot.

EC has pretty awful air support overall, especially WGer. It's easier to offload a lot of your air defense into elite fighters than to maintain a good Roland/Gepard radar network and save money by dumping the rest of your ADN budget into anti helo AA. When a Redfor guy has to dump hundreds of points into an inflexible, SEADable ADN while I can hold air superiority and only have to have a bunch of mistrals and roland1s the ground, I think you can see a few of the benefits.

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urho
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Re: West Germany’s Bundeswehr in WRD

Postby urho » Tue 7 Oct 2014 14:04

Forimar wrote:
To players who believe Eurocorps overall is too strong compared to all others in WRD, something which really is not what this topic is all about, I can only say: host national deck/battlegroup games and all your Eurocorps problems are solved. Other than that, I advise forum members to start a “Eurocorps in WRD” topic to specifically discuss that issue and not invade this topic with that discussion.

Why should all other coalitions be banned from a lobby just to deal with one being a bit too powerful? Like it or not, Eurocorps is a valid point because they can't just be willed away from existance. Any major buffs to Wger will also be felt when playing with or against the Euro deck.

Concerning a Bundeswehr Typhoon in WRD it is useful to show that having four top level Interceptors/ASFs in a deck/battlegroup is currently already possible in WRD. But it seems to not present any problems since there are no long running forum topics discussing such an issue.

No, it's not.
- 1 slot of 1 elite Su 27S at 150 points
- 1 slot of 1 elite Su 27 M at 200 points (unique multi-role case)

First isn't top level, second isn't an ASF. Try fighting Rafs or a Su27PU without SRAAMs.
- 1 slot of 1 elite F-16C Block 52 at 160 points
- 1 slot of 1 elite F-15A Eagle at 130 points

F16C is great but also technically not top level, F15... Sparrows, AIM9L and 30% ECM. Nuff said.
- 1 slot of 1 elite Tornado F.3 at 135 points
- 1 slot of 2 elite Tornado F.2 at 110 points

50% ECM and F&F or bust

A top level fighter needs 2 things to make it good, F&F MRAAMs and high ECM. If we go by your definition of top level fighters EC already has the best loadout in game with mirages+rafs+KWS.

I have never in hundreds of WRD multiplayer games seen any USSR, USA, UK or French player deploy four slots out of five with 100+ costing elite experience level Interceptors/ASFs. Why? Because Interceptors/ASFs do not decide ground combat and four aircraft slots can be better utilized with other air assets than only Interceptors/ASFs. Other air assets which can actually directly influence ground combat, which Interceptors/ASFs clearly cannot.

EC has pretty awful air support overall, especially WGer. It's easier to offload a lot of your air defense into elite fighters than to maintain a good Roland/Gepard radar network and save money by dumping the rest of your ADN budget into anti helo AA. When a Redfor guy has to dump hundreds of points into an inflexible, SEADable ADN while I can hold air superiority and only have to have a bunch of mistrals and roland1s the ground, I think you can see a few of the benefits.

WGer doesn't have Mistrals or Roland 1s.
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Re: West Germany’s Bundeswehr in WRD

Postby keebs63 » Tue 7 Oct 2014 14:09

I love how people have never heard of this special thing, I believe they call it an AIRBORNE DECK
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Re: West Germany’s Bundeswehr in WRD

Postby Ritterlich » Tue 7 Oct 2014 14:21

What the flying Spaghettimonster?

Just put the EF in for FRG on 1 card of 0/2/0/1/0 and prototype.

What's the matter / problem with that? None!



And to those screaming "AIRBORNE DECK": Who cares, it is non competitive anyway and carries significant disadvantages in most other fields. Then, ask yourself, what is wrong with an airborne deck that is good at its job, and has so many holes and weaknesses in the other equally important disciplines?

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Re: West Germany’s Bundeswehr in WRD

Postby SKLKNKR » Tue 7 Oct 2014 16:08

Did the M109G1A3 get any sort of equipment different than the American M109A2? I highly doubt Eugen would give a nation a ten second arty if it would mean another nation gets two, and then more nations could argue thier arty pieces deserve 10 second aim times....

Seems like too big a can of worms.
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Object199
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Re: West Germany’s Bundeswehr in WRD

Postby Object199 » Tue 7 Oct 2014 16:25

SKLKNKR wrote:Did the M109G1A3 get any sort of equipment different than the American M109A2?


In the 1980´s all german M109 got the upgrade to the american M109A3 status aaaaaaaaaaaaand:
-new gun system from the FH155-1
- new FCS called Aurora [Autonome Richt- und Orientierungsaustattung Rohrartillerie]

..... before there will be new Eurocorps OP tears and fanboy accusations, better quote a marshall .....



Flieger wrote:- M109A3GA1: reduced aimtime, preferably 10s.

Historical/technical reasoning:
The M109A3GA1 features the new FH-155-1 gun system and the advanced IFAB and AURORA fire control systems allowing it to aim and shoot very fast. In the first 13 seconds, three shots can be made.
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Re: West Germany’s Bundeswehr in WRD

Postby SKLKNKR » Tue 7 Oct 2014 16:46

Object199 wrote:
Flieger wrote:- M109A3GA1: reduced aimtime, preferably 10s.

Historical/technical reasoning:
The M109A3GA1 features the new FH-155-1 gun system and the advanced IFAB and AURORA fire control systems allowing it to aim and shoot very fast. In the first 13 seconds, three shots can be made.


Thanks, that answers that.
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