Buff the T-34

captaincarnage
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Re: Buff the T-34

Postby captaincarnage » Wed 19 Nov 2014 01:24

Niscimble wrote:
panzersaurkrautwefer wrote:
You missed my point, and then went off on an unrelated tangent. If ANY unit is useless, there are ways to make it useful other than straight up AP or range buff. It is a game after all. If you think 1750m is an unrealistic range and would break the game, then perhaps the T-34 could be knocked down to 10 points. That would help it be slightly more useful.


I read your point. I'm just saying some units SHOULD be useless. Too much utility for something that's garbage lead to M18s being useful again, which was patently insanity sauce.


I don't think it's a good idea to just leave some of the units that they spent time and money on in the dust. They don't have to be good, but every unit in the game should have at least one use, otherwise what's the point?


What if that one use is and was to take an ATGM to the face so something more expensive didn't have to?
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fatfluffycat
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Re: Buff the T-34

Postby fatfluffycat » Wed 19 Nov 2014 01:25

Woozle wrote:You know, M18s, T-34s, M36s were all in use in the 1990s, Image


Why do they have the most avail? And why does 90's stuff have extremely low avail?
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panzersaurkrautwefer
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Re: Buff the T-34

Postby panzersaurkrautwefer » Wed 19 Nov 2014 01:25

And so was the Henri Martini rifle. In a game simulating very low capability forces in a Bosnia 1993 game, they have a place.

Not in a game that has just short of thrown in science fiction units representing the various countries of the Cold War at max strength.
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Niscimble
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Re: Buff the T-34

Postby Niscimble » Wed 19 Nov 2014 01:32

panzersaurkrautwefer wrote:
I don't think it's a good idea to just leave some of the units that they spent time and money on in the dust. They don't have to be good, but every unit in the game should have at least one use, otherwise what's the point?


1. Inflating the unit count

2. They may have situation use in CAT-B/C games

3. It is iconic enough to the Cold War Era, terriblness or no, that it would be expected to be included in the game.

There's a lot of units in the game that collect dust. T-34 is just a high profile one.


Then fix all of them! Just because one unit is useless should not be the reason why another one is useless. Either way, this argument is going to go in circles, so I'm going to stop now. Chalk it up to a difference in opinion.
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Niscimble
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Re: Buff the T-34

Postby Niscimble » Wed 19 Nov 2014 01:34

captaincarnage wrote:What if that one use is and was to take an ATGM to the face so something more expensive didn't have to?


There are cheaper and more numerous units in less crowded sections for that purpose.
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Re: Buff the T-34

Postby terror51247 » Wed 19 Nov 2014 01:36

I don't think it's a good idea to just leave some of the units that they spent time and money on in the dust. They don't have to be good, but every unit in the game should have at least one use, otherwise what's the point?

Maybe eugen shouldnt ve spent their money on modeling t34.
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fatfluffycat
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Re: Buff the T-34

Postby fatfluffycat » Wed 19 Nov 2014 01:39

terror51247 wrote:
I don't think it's a good idea to just leave some of the units that they spent time and money on in the dust. They don't have to be good, but every unit in the game should have at least one use, otherwise what's the point?

Maybe eugen shouldnt ve spent their money on modeling t34.


Well the first Game was set in Europe in the 60's - 80's.
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spyker92
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Re: Buff the T-34

Postby spyker92 » Wed 19 Nov 2014 01:47

Regnar wrote:
fatfluffycat wrote:inb4 "I just want my 170pt vs 170pt tankz battles only pls"

Tell me more about how a tank from 1943 should be viable in a game taking place in the 1990s.


The same way an assault rifle with very little innovation from the '50s remains the most popular weapon in the world. If you do something right the first time, it doesn't need a lot of fixing. :lol:

That said, all units should be viable / niche. Having a unit in the game that is considered useless is inherently idiotic and a waste of resources. "LOL BUT CAT B/C" is not a viable argument in my eyes. There's no reason 1940-70s relic units can not be expected to be as successful if not more then modern equivalents (which are often more multipurpose) in light support roles, or in situations where lack of range or vision is not a concern. They just provide different strains on the deck pricing.

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panzersaurkrautwefer
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Re: Buff the T-34

Postby panzersaurkrautwefer » Wed 19 Nov 2014 01:54

The same way an assault rifle with very little innovation from the '50s remains the most popular weapon in the world. If you do something right the first time, it doesn't need a lot of fixing. :lol:


......yes. Of course.

I could write a rant about:

1. How much of the T-34 was not at all "right" the first, or second time

2. The huge difference between an infantry rifle and a tank

But I don't have the heart in it today except to imply that it's really stupid to assume the T-34 kept up with anything after 1945.
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Re: Buff the T-34

Postby Lord Helmchen » Wed 19 Nov 2014 02:06

Comparing a rifle with a tank says a lot already...
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