New gamemode suggestion

holoween
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New gamemode suggestion

Postby holoween » Tue 11 Oct 2016 10:10

economy:
all units destroyed refund 100% of their price (making points a population limit effectively)
both sides start with 1000 points
total points for each player (points of units on the field + reseve) are modified like this:
(+3 base growth + (number of friendly held sectors - number of enemy held sectors) )/s
every 10 min base income is reduced by 1
total points per player cannot exceed 3000

victory conditions:
all enemy cvs destroyed
enemies total points per player dropp to 900
own all sectors

effects of this gamemode:
army sizes remain similar throughout most of the battle allowing an easier recovery from bad engagements
every unit in the deck becomes important as its easily possible to use up every single unit inside a deck
cost effectiveness of individual units becomes less of a problem as it could be viable to loose 600 points of medium tanks to kill 300 points of heavy tanks if the medium card has more tanks left afterwards or to put it differently total price of a unit card becomes more important than individual unit price making more unit cards viable choices

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Mister Maf
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Re: New gamemode suggestion

Postby Mister Maf » Tue 11 Oct 2016 10:17

I would argue that cost-effectiveness would be more important instead of less because of the tight budget but I like the idea of playing with constant pop cap instead of by income.
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holoween
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Re: New gamemode suggestion

Postby holoween » Tue 11 Oct 2016 10:23

they have different advantedges. i could trade 500 points worth of medium tanks against a single 150 point heavy and it would be woth it if the heavy card is only a total of 300 points vs 1500 points on the medium card. in any other gamemode such a trade would loose you the game and any engagement where you loose more points than you destroyed is bad in this gamemode depending on how many of the individual units are available per card loosing more points worth of units can be worth it.

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Re: New gamemode suggestion

Postby RedFive » Tue 11 Oct 2016 15:46

1000pts isn't a lot to cover a whole map, even a 1v1 map. Most 1v1 matches end up with 2x to 3x that value of units on the field. Maybe that's the intention, though?

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Re: New gamemode suggestion

Postby holoween » Tue 11 Oct 2016 20:54

well your limit increases to 3000 over the first 10 min so you do get 3times the starting points.

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QUAD
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Re: New gamemode suggestion

Postby QUAD » Tue 11 Oct 2016 21:47

the biggest flaw of Wargame is the fact that the competitive gamemode has zero economic depth to it, which makes losses unrecoverable from and punishes offensives/puts far too much weight on the first engagement. It also puts too much weight on units to soak damage and deal raw damage.

I like the OPs idea of turning CP into a kind of pop cap that is increased by taking territory, though refunds of lost units should trickle in slowly so keeping units alive is still rewarded.
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Re: New gamemode suggestion

Postby ToTheMetal » Tue 11 Oct 2016 21:57

QUAD wrote:the biggest flaw of Wargame is the fact that the competitive gamemode has zero economic depth to it, which makes losses unrecoverable from and punishes offensives/puts far too much weight on the first engagement. It also puts too much weight on units to soak damage and deal raw damage.

I like the OPs idea of turning CP into a kind of pop cap that is increased by taking territory, though refunds of lost units should trickle in slowly so keeping units alive is still rewarded.

Unless you artificially handicap the winning player, the economical factor would be another thing that snowballs. That's the way any RTS works.
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Re: New gamemode suggestion

Postby QUAD » Tue 11 Oct 2016 22:00

ToTheMetal wrote:
QUAD wrote:the biggest flaw of Wargame is the fact that the competitive gamemode has zero economic depth to it, which makes losses unrecoverable from and punishes offensives/puts far too much weight on the first engagement. It also puts too much weight on units to soak damage and deal raw damage.

I like the OPs idea of turning CP into a kind of pop cap that is increased by taking territory, though refunds of lost units should trickle in slowly so keeping units alive is still rewarded.

Unless you artificially handicap the losing player, the economical factor would be another thing that snowballs. That's the way any RTS works.


Not really though, if you make a big push in SC2 it always has the intent of of damaging their econ via destroying a base, forcing them to defend, killing workers, and so on. If you make a big push in Wargame you are doing it only to get victory points, which is why most CQ games are decided more by early losses snowballing into an inferior army than the victory points themselves.

I REALLY like the OPs idea, it would actually be a big boon to stuff like Line infantry and currently seldom used mediums.
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Re: New gamemode suggestion

Postby ToTheMetal » Tue 11 Oct 2016 22:13

QUAD wrote:Not really though, if you make a big push in SC2 it always has the intent of of damaging their econ via destroying a base, forcing them to defend, killing workers, and so on. If you make a big push in Wargame you are doing it only to get victory points, which is why most CQ games are decided more by early losses snowballing into an inferior army than the victory points themselves.

I REALLY like the OPs idea, it would actually be a big boon to stuff like Line infantry and currently seldom used mediums.

Having map control allows you to secure more command zones (those are supposed to give you the economical advantage, amirite?) eventually resulting in a bigger army.
Starcraft has a completely different eco system, albeit droning is surely easier when you do have the map control. Btw, in SC big pushes are usually supposed to finish the enemy right away or doing some serious damage to put your economy ahead, unless they happen in T3 or so. In the end, the player with better economy always wins and, as I said, acquiring that big economy is always easier if you already have something on the board. Applying this logic to Wargame if you lose your deployment pretty much entirely you're still screwed and enemy having economical advantage (which he's able to secure due to you losing most of your shit) will screw you even more as the game lasts.
Last edited by ToTheMetal on Tue 11 Oct 2016 22:19, edited 1 time in total.
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holoween
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Re: New gamemode suggestion

Postby holoween » Tue 11 Oct 2016 22:18

ToTheMetal wrote:
QUAD wrote:the biggest flaw of Wargame is the fact that the competitive gamemode has zero economic depth to it, which makes losses unrecoverable from and punishes offensives/puts far too much weight on the first engagement. It also puts too much weight on units to soak damage and deal raw damage.

I like the OPs idea of turning CP into a kind of pop cap that is increased by taking territory, though refunds of lost units should trickle in slowly so keeping units alive is still rewarded.

Unless you artificially handicap the winning player, the economical factor would be another thing that snowballs. That's the way any RTS works.


actually since there is a limit on the tatal ammount of units in a deck and the limit to total army size its really hard to snowball with this gamemode. the economic advantedge from holding more territory adds op quite slowly (though it gets harsher the longer the game progresses) so essentially you trade units for territory throughout the game at a fairly equal point level so single good engagements dont decide the game.

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