Correct Finnish 2S5 Accuracy

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hansbroger
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Correct Finnish 2S5 Accuracy

Postby hansbroger » Tue 6 Dec 2016 03:28

In game the dispersion assigned to the 2A36 on the 2S5 is.... Lacking. This is in keeping with the repeated presumption that RedFor artillery is inaccurate.

Issue: 2S5 (2A36) has unrealistically poor accuracy of 6370m.... The same as a M109A2.

Reality: 2S5 (2A36) is nearly if not as accurate as the M777 using RAP which is more accurate than M109.... Meaning it deserves accuracy equivalent to at least that given to the M109A3.

Solution: Improve accuracy of 2S5 to at least that of 2S19 if not that of 2S7 and or other long range precision systems. Dispersion to 3640m-4550m.

Reasoning
The gun 2A36 is claimed to have a dispersion of:
По Боку (on the side) ВБ(VB) of 20m (trying to track down the mils and По Дальности Вд/Х Мак (a vertical dispersion of) 1/267 ie ,37%
To compare the M777 is claimed to have a vertical dispersion of ,30% (unassisted) ,35% (RAP)
And horizontal of 1 mil (low angle) or 2 mil (high angle)
https://fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/lw155.htm

This is a damn accurate gun. We're talking 3640m material, 4550m at worst.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... u2XtbkRJNg

Accuracy of the M109A1 (interchangeable with the M109A2)
Has a precision probable error range/deflection of .33/.60 with conventional shells and .74/3.37 with RAP. Markedly inferior to both M777 and 2A36
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... p5_eMlXFkQ


More interesting info Ad Infinitum on 2A36 Гиацинт-Б
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... BHklVGjfHQ

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... W_6ws1x1UA
Last edited by hansbroger on Tue 6 Dec 2016 08:40, edited 1 time in total.
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CommanderDef
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Re: "Fix" Finnish 2S5 Accuracy

Postby CommanderDef » Tue 6 Dec 2016 04:12

Agreed, especially for Finnish army, that has no accurate arty. Probably such buff should come with higher price or lower availability.

Current state of this Telak is a bit funny. 5 pieces that are inaccurate, with such a long volley that in the end the whole area is covered with shells. Easy to be countered though.

Why is the Sholef and it's Finnish brother inaccurate?
Sometimes I wish my country wasn't included in the beginning, but coming as a paid DLC...
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Desty
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Re: "Fix" Finnish 2S5 Accuracy

Postby Desty » Tue 6 Dec 2016 08:27

You should not have used "fix" in your title...
Eugen only fixes what is broken...and it is not broken ^^

But I agree with buffing the 2S5 since their coalition has no high end tube artillery.
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[EUG]MadMat
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Re: "Fix" Finnish 2S5 Accuracy

Postby [EUG]MadMat » Tue 6 Dec 2016 10:00

Desty wrote:You should not have used "fix" in your title...
Eugen only fixes what is broken...and it is not broken ^^

You seem to have saved this thread from a dark fate indeed ... ;)

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Desty
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Re: "Fix" Finnish 2S5 Accuracy

Postby Desty » Tue 6 Dec 2016 15:28

[EUG]MadMat wrote:
Desty wrote:You should not have used "fix" in your title...
Eugen only fixes what is broken...and it is not broken ^^

You seem to have saved this thread from a dark fate indeed ... ;)


Everything to please the gods at Eugen Systems! :D
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hansbroger
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Re: "Fix" Finnish 2S5 Accuracy

Postby hansbroger » Tue 6 Dec 2016 19:02

[EUG]MadMat wrote:
Desty wrote:You should not have used "fix" in your title...
Eugen only fixes what is broken...and it is not broken ^^

You seem to have saved this thread from a dark fate indeed ... ;)

Indeed the word choice was incorrect :lol:
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Re: Correct Finnish 2S5 Accuracy

Postby jhfts » Wed 7 Dec 2016 04:03

I agree wholeheartedly with the OP. I made a similar suggestion for the N. Korean Tok'chon guns; unfortunately, it seems that the Tok'chons were used as the basis for the 2S5, rather than viewed as something to be fixed corrected in their own right.

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Re: Correct Finnish 2S5 Accuracy

Postby hansbroger » Wed 7 Dec 2016 05:22

jhfts wrote:I agree wholeheartedly with the OP. I made a similar suggestion for the N. Korean Tok'chon guns; unfortunately, it seems that the Tok'chons were used as the basis for the 2S5, rather than viewed as something to be fixed corrected in their own right.


Well not surprisingly the accuracy requirements for 2S5 probably were derived from the performance of the M-46. The 2S5 was adopted to provide better range, fragmentation, and ability to use cargo/nuclear shells for CRBN, all capabilities that the M-46 lacked or failed to provide satisfactorily (it has been claimed based on anecdotal evidence from the Vietnam war that fragmentation was large, erratic and saturation wasn't optimal).

Overall what I can find on the M-46 claims that it has:
Vertical dispersion VD/X=1/267 ie .37 (M777 by comparison shoots .35 at comparable distances)
On the side XB=14 m
This compares well with the 2A36 and it means that our friend the 130mm Tok'chon is due for a much needed accuracy correction. This makes it at least as accurate as a M109A3 or DANA at the 5460m dispersion rating if not the 4550m rating given to accurate RedFor guns.
http://csef.ru/en/oborona-i-bezopasnost ... 30-mm-4910
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Re: Correct Finnish 2S5 Accuracy

Postby Steamfunk » Wed 7 Dec 2016 05:46

This is actually the one unit I would have preferred for the USSR. I can understand why they said no to the Tyulpan, but this could be very useful.

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Re: Correct Finnish 2S5 Accuracy

Postby hansbroger » Wed 7 Dec 2016 05:53

Steamfunk wrote:This is actually the one unit I would have preferred for the USSR. I can understand why they said no to the Tyulpan, but this could be very useful.


It's really rather great, it bridges the capability of say, the 2S3 and that of the 2S7. It provides the volume of fire (if not slightly greater) of the 2S3 with range and accuracy approaching that of the 2S7, its only drawback being its lower HE. I cannot overstate just how accurate this gun is to be achieving this rate of dispersion at ranges of 28.5-40km, it was a very expensive and specialized piece of machinery meant to hunt down enemy artillery, air defenses and tactical CRBN/C&C assets, there's a reason why it was put in dedicated independent artillery units.

It really should be a fragile, 15s aimtime 4550m-3640m dispersion self propelled gun, it's at least as accurate as the 2A65 MSTA-B if not moreso and that thing is good for a rather suspiciously high 4550m.

This could really help Finland.
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