The Dutch F-16A Block 15 OCU

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Razzmann
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Re: The Dutch F-16A Block 15 OCU

Postby Razzmann » Wed 11 Jan 2017 17:26

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Re: The Dutch F-16A Block 15 OCU

Postby Greyhound » Wed 11 Jan 2017 17:27

Yes, please. This would help NLGR coalition a lot.
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Re: The Dutch F-16A Block 15 OCU

Postby CommanderDef » Wed 11 Jan 2017 17:36

Please no. If you are using ATGM plane, try going for side armor, not requesting another sniper plane. And seriously, getting another Su-27M shouldn't go with just 10pts price nerf.

As for non-radar long range Roland, please no. There is already EOTS, HEOTS, Neva M1T and each of them is a plague. Besides, original post requested anti-helo. What's wrong with 2800m SPAAGs?
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Re: The Dutch F-16A Block 15 OCU

Postby Razzmann » Wed 11 Jan 2017 17:41

CommanderDef wrote:Please no. If you are using ATGM plane, try going for side armor, not requesting another sniper plane. And seriously, getting another Su-27M shouldn't go with just 10pts price nerf.

It'd have 2 instead of 4 ATGM, 2 instead of 4 radar missiles and less ECM.

CommanderDef wrote:As for non-radar long range Roland, please no. There is already EOTS, HEOTS, Neva M1T and each of them is a plague. Besides, original post requested anti-helo. What's wrong with 2800m SPAAGs?

You misunderstand. The non radar Roland would not simply lose its radar.
Imagine more like a Roland 2/3-ish unit where the anti helo and anti plane ranges are swapped. More similar to a guided crotale, like Demonicjapsel mentioned.

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Re: The Dutch F-16A Block 15 OCU

Postby another505 » Wed 11 Jan 2017 17:45

My suggestion would be as follows
- 10 pts price nerf
- 2 AGM-65G's
- Veterancy changed to fit this new price bracket.


Im not sure if it needs a price nerf and veterancy buff with AGM 65G. Sure, you are losing 2 missiles, but you getting 2 much better ones.
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Re: The Dutch F-16A Block 15 OCU

Postby Greyhound » Wed 11 Jan 2017 17:47

CommanderDef wrote:Please no. If you are using ATGM plane, try going for side armor, not requesting another sniper plane. And seriously, getting another Su-27M shouldn't go with just 10pts price nerf.

It would be more like a Seria if anything, not a Su-27M. I don't see anything wrong with Seria.
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Re: The Dutch F-16A Block 15 OCU

Postby Demonicjapsel » Wed 11 Jan 2017 17:58

another505 wrote:
My suggestion would be as follows
- 10 pts price nerf
- 2 AGM-65G's
- Veterancy changed to fit this new price bracket.


Im not sure if it needs a price nerf and veterancy buff with AGM 65G. Sure, you are losing 2 missiles, but you getting 2 much better ones.


The Veterancy was more because i couldn't remember if it had the same vet as stuff like the Seria or not, 2 trained 1 elite is good enough.

The 10pts price nerf, IMHO, is deserved as its a fairly well protected platform that is tight turning, and has a pair of AMRAAMS to protect itself, which is something that should cost a bit.

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Re: The Dutch F-16A Block 15 OCU

Postby CommanderDef » Wed 11 Jan 2017 18:03

Razzmann wrote:
CommanderDef wrote:Please no. If you are using ATGM plane, try going for side armor, not requesting another sniper plane. And seriously, getting another Su-27M shouldn't go with just 10pts price nerf.

It'd have 2 instead of 4 ATGM, 2 instead of 4 radar missiles and less ECM.

Greyhound wrote:It would be more like a Seria if anything, not a Su-27M. I don't see anything wrong with Seria.

I wouldn't like to see 30AP F&F on AMRAAM armed multirole plane. Then do it for the PeaceRhine instead. This will bring it to more coalitions.
Razzmann wrote:
CommanderDef wrote:As for non-radar long range Roland, please no. There is already EOTS, HEOTS, Neva M1T and each of them is a plague. Besides, original post requested anti-helo. What's wrong with 2800m SPAAGs?

You misunderstand. The non radar Roland would not simply lose its radar.
Imagine more like a Roland 2/3-ish unit where the anti helo and anti plane ranges are swapped. More similar to a guided crotale, like Demonicjapsel mentioned.

Can you explain why would you need such unit? To smash soviet Akula combo? Because there are no other Redfor helos that have high AP on 2800m range. Outside of Ka-52 there is no other reason not to use Gepard. It makes a small sense to have such unit on red side, like ITO 90, with Hellfire becoming standard ATGM on Bluefor favorite coalitions which is I believe against the original heli x AA balance idea.
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Re: The Dutch F-16A Block 15 OCU

Postby Razzmann » Wed 11 Jan 2017 18:08

CommanderDef wrote:Can you explain why would you need such unit? To smash soviet Akula combo? Because there are no other Redfor helos that have high AP on 2800m range. Outside of Ka-52 there is no other reason not to use Gepard. It makes a small sense to have such unit on red side, like ITO 90, with Hellfire becoming standard ATGM on Bluefor favorite coalitions which is I believe against the original heli x AA balance idea.

SEAD planes also exist. And it is not simply about dealing with helicopters. It is about having a not micro intensive unit that can somewhat deal with any aerial unit. For flanks or fronts where you don't expect a big push right away.

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Re: The Dutch F-16A Block 15 OCU

Postby CommanderDef » Wed 11 Jan 2017 18:12

Razzmann wrote:
CommanderDef wrote:Can you explain why would you need such unit? To smash soviet Akula combo? Because there are no other Redfor helos that have high AP on 2800m range. Outside of Ka-52 there is no other reason not to use Gepard. It makes a small sense to have such unit on red side, like ITO 90, with Hellfire becoming standard ATGM on Bluefor favorite coalitions which is I believe against the original heli x AA balance idea.

SEAD planes also exist. And it is not simply about dealing with helicopters. It is about having a not micro intensive unit that can somewhat deal with any aerial unit. For flanks or fronts where you don't expect a big push right away.

If you got Strela10M or AMX-30 Roland stats, you would say it's weak, right? And I think that anything better than that is too good. You would have to issue such unit to everyone to keep the balance.
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