On T-72M2 Moderna and its FCS.

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HrcAk47
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On T-72M2 Moderna and its FCS.

Postby HrcAk47 » Thu 12 Jan 2017 14:53

I have been asked to write about Moderna and it's FCS, so here we go.

(Czecho)Slovak project

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Moderna was a Slovak post-breakup project intended to develop a modernization project for its vast fleet of export-variant T-72s. Moderna, as we know it, has been prototype-completed in 1993. Its full name is T-72M2 Moderna 2.

The Yugoslav connection

I was never paying much attention to Modernas, before a certain post on these forums led my attention to this. Upon further research, I found the following external elements of the FCS on the Moderna, seen in real life photos, as well as on the ingame model.

Spoiler : :
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On the above pics, the following parts pop out.

MES-84 meteo-sensor (Fotona) LIRD laser irradiation detection sensor (Fotona), TIGS gunner sight with thermals (Fotona)

All these are parts and modules of the Slovenian EFCS-3-72A computerised fire-control system, developed by Fotona.

EFCS-3-72A

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A member in the family of the EFCS-3 fire control systems.

Spoiler : :
Fotona has developed a number of fire control systems for T-72 tank, tailored to the prospective customers’ requirements. Some of them retain original TPD-K1 day laser sight, either as a back up or as an alternative source of laser range. The most advanced ones, such as EFCS3-M84 system for M-84 tank, however, do not rely on the original equipment whatsoever, offering instead the following advantages:
• Fast and simple installation, maintenance and repair,
• High first round hit probability and short engagement
time,
• 24 hours per day operation capability, assured by a state-of-the art thermal imager as a night sight,
• Full integration with the existing automatic gunloading system,
• Dynamic trunnion tilt sensing,
• Tilt-independent target tracking,
• Firing on the move with stabilized gunner’s field of view and gun-independent line of sight,
• Variety of system configurations and optional equipment ,
• Optimal performance-to-cost ratio;


it is comprised from the following modules (Source: Kočevar I. Oklep na Slovenskem)

Spoiler : :
- stabilizirana dnevno/nočna laserska nišanska sprava za namerilca (SGS-84) (Stabilized Day/Night Laser sight for Gunner)
- stabilizirana termalna laserska nišanska sprava za namerilca (TIGS) (Stabilized Gunner's Thermal Laser Sight for Gunner with thermal FLIR)
- servo elektronika (SEB-72A) (Servo electronics)
- senzor elevacije (GES-84) (Gun Elevation sensor)
- zaščitna kapa (TPC-84) (Ballistic cover for the external part of the sight)
- mehanična vez med topom i SGS-84 (MLG-84) (Mechanical link between the gun and the sight)
- balistični računalnik (FCC-84) (Ballistic computer)
- komandirjev panel (COP-72A) (Commander's panel)
- zunanji zaslon za komandirja (CRD-72A) (External screen for commander)
- modul namerilca (GCB-84) (Gunner's module)
- modul namerilca z termalnim senzorjem (TIGS) (Gunner's module with thermal FLIR)
- vmesni modul DIB-84 (Intermediate module)
- SGS obroč za pritrditev (MOR-55B) (SGS mounting ring)
- senzorji (SNS-84) (Sensors)
- elektronika žiroskopa (GEB-84) (Gyroblock electronics)
- meteo-senzor (MES-84) (Meteosensor)
- senzor temperature smodnika (PTS-72A) (Gunpowder temperature sensor)
- multispektralni senzor laserskega obsevanja (LIRD-4A) (Laser irradiation sensor)


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(SGS-84 day/night sight)

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(MES meteo sensor)

EFCS-3 was described as a modular system which could be assembled from all the possible options listed above.

Stabilization

Slovaks apparently toyed with the stabilization. Such move was mandatory in order to get all benefits of tank gun fire gating.
Spoiler : :
"Zlepšenie stabilizácie
Veža je stabilizovaná v odmere a kanón v námere elektro-hydraulickou stabilizáciou (tým je kanón stabilizovaný v odmere i námere). Stabilizátor v rozhodujúcej miere ovplyvňuje výsledné parametre SRP. Pôvodná konštrukcia stabilizátora stanovovala strednú amplitúdu kmitov stabilizovaného kanóna na menej ako 0,8 mrad v námere a 2 mrad v odmere, čo nedávalo žiaden predpoklad na splnenie TTP stanovených SRP. Optimálne bolo dosiahnuť zlepšenie na 0,3 mrad v námere a 0,5 mrad v odmere. Tieto parametre sa dosiahli zmenami v riadiacich obvodoch a redukciou vôle v kanóne a uloženiach veže. Pôvodný gyroskop nahradil nový model, ktorý umožòuje získať všetky potrebné veličiny pre SRP. Úspešnú realizáciu tejto zmeny umožnil digitálny regulátor. Regulátory sú integrované priamo do balistického počítača. Výhodou riešenia je zachovanie pôvodných hydropohonov námeru a odmeru. Použitá koncepcia znižuje priestorovú náročnosť riešenia, zjednodušuje vzájomné prepojenie a dovoľuje pružnejšiu modifikáciu systému."


Turret is stabilized horizontally and gun vertically (So tank gun is stabilized both horizontally and vertically).Stabilizer crucially affect the final parameters of the FCS. The original design of the stabilizer determined the mean amplitude of oscillations of stabilized cannon to less than 0.8 mrad in elevation and 2 mrad horizontally (turret), which did not give any presumption to meet the TTP needed by FCS. Optimal figures were 0.3 mrad in elevation and 0.5 mrad horizontally. These parameters were achieved by changes in the control circuits, reducing the will in the cannon and some changes regarding turret ring. Original gyro was replaced by a new model , which allows to obtain all necessary parameters for the FCS. Digital controller/regulator allowed successful implementation of these changes. The controllers are integrated directly into the ballistic computer. Advantage of this solution was, that it allowed to preserve the original hydraulic drives for elevation and horizontal movement. Used conception reduces the complexity of spatial solutions, simplifies the interconnection and permits more flexible modification of the system.


Result was, however, not the absolutely greatest, however, still an order-of-magnitude improvement over the base T-72M1 stabilization it began from.

Misc

The ammo capacity of the whole tank is stated as 39, 3 rounds less than T-72-based tanks.

Moderna currently ingame

Moderna currently suffers from terrible accuracy, performing even worse than the mid-70s Leopard 1A4, which is rather absurd. It was justified with geopolitical situation and WW3 denying (Czecho)Slovak access to western technology, which was fully understandable. However, the FCS is not "Western". With Yugoslavia making it into Wargame, and no less in a coalition with Czechoslovakia, I feel like it should receive better stats.

Proposal

Moderna goes up to 65% accuracy at minimum, 70% at optimum.

Moderna goes up to 50-55% stabilization.

Price adjusted accordingly


E-sources, for further reading:

About Fotona (note how it shows a Moderna 2 as part of the promo material)

A PDF catalogue of Slovenian defense industry exports.

On Slovak armor developments.

On T-72M2 Moderna (czech)


Paper sources:

Kočevar I. Oklep na Slovenskem, Defensor, 2008.
Navodilo za uporabo novih sistemov in komponent v tanku M-55S1 (USP), Ravne, 2001.
Navodilo za uporabo EFCS3-84, Fotona, 1996.
Navodilo za uporabo LIRD-1A/84, Fotona, 1996.
EFCS 3-55B, Fotona, 1995.
EFCS 3-55B, Navodilo za uporabo in osnovno vzdrževanje, SV-TZ-120, GŠSV, 1999.
EFCS 3-55B Sistem za usmerjanje ognja za tank T-55, Fotona, 1995.
LIRD-1A detektor laserske osvetlitve, Fotona, 1995.
The SEAD never bothered me anyway.

SMB Yugoslavia Retexture Mod, now released, v.1.0

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FrangibleCover
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Re: On T-72M2 Moderna and its FCS.

Postby FrangibleCover » Thu 12 Jan 2017 14:57

+1 since that's what it was actually like. It's best to assign hard stats in accordance with realistic performance and then adjust soft stats like price to balance the performance of a unit.

Someone's going to have to bring the nerfbat to Entente though.
What if Wargame stuck to timeframe?
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Re: On T-72M2 Moderna and its FCS.

Postby Ribar » Thu 12 Jan 2017 15:10

+1
First the MiG-23BN ECM, now this :( so sweet...
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Re: On T-72M2 Moderna and its FCS.

Postby Sweedish_Gunner » Thu 12 Jan 2017 15:40

I like the idea but it's not worth loosing availability and an increase in price to get that accuracy. You'd just end up with a worse T-80UM for the same price, which would be in a worse spot than the current Moderna.

A 5% increase with no penalty on price or availability I can get behind.

I think the idea was that in NSWP decks the Moderna is the brute force tank and the Twardy is the sniper. If you buff the Moderna more you make the Twardy worse than it is.
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Re: On T-72M2 Moderna and its FCS.

Postby HrcAk47 » Thu 12 Jan 2017 16:06

FrangibleCover wrote:+1 since that's what it was actually like. It's best to assign hard stats in accordance with realistic performance and then adjust soft stats like price to balance the performance of a unit.

Someone's going to have to bring the nerfbat to Entente though.


I am not particularly opposed to the idea of breaking up Entente, but I leave such decisionmaking to Eugen. Maybe on the crossing between WG:RD and "le mystery project 1 or 2”.
The SEAD never bothered me anyway.

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Re: On T-72M2 Moderna and its FCS.

Postby pebakesa » Thu 12 Jan 2017 16:08

Sweedish_Gunner wrote:I think the idea was that in NSWP decks the Moderna is the brute force tank and the Twardy is the sniper. If you buff the Moderna more you make the Twardy worse than it is.


Before the paid DLC era and the exploitation of extensive community research (which is generally motivated to be true to or over-model historical capability) the unit stats were, in my opinion, less dictated by realism and more by game design. That emphasis allows for greater diversity and clearer roles for units, like the duality of the Moderna and the Twardy.

I suspect that this development will soon come full circle, since when you stretch the time limits enough into the '90s, more or less every coalition ends up with identically maxed out capabilities - the superpowers reach those levels with late '80s units - and so sculpting flavourful coalitions with meaningful yet balanced unit choices becomes a question of game design , rather than historical accuracy, yet again.

For example, Eugen certainly can model the FDF or the Yugoslavs as a decisively high-tech force, but they may also choose to fit them in entirely different niches; even if every single unit is modeled to the absolute maximum of their historical capabilities, the selection of units that actually make it into the game is fundamentally arbitrary, after all, and Eugen has no obligation to include the entirety of the current catalogue in future renditions of Wargame.

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Re: On T-72M2 Moderna and its FCS.

Postby urogard » Thu 12 Jan 2017 16:25

HrcAk47 wrote:Proposal
Moderna goes up to 65% accuracy at minimum, 70% at optimum.
Moderna goes up to 50-55% stabilization.
Price adjusted accordingly

Even though I'd love a buff to the Moderna, I would absolutely hate it if the buff came at the expense of availability.

But then again Leclerc is allowed to have 70% accuracy with 12 RoF and 22/21 AV and isn't it back to 3 per card again?

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Re: On T-72M2 Moderna and its FCS.

Postby molnibalage » Thu 12 Jan 2017 16:42

urogard wrote:
HrcAk47 wrote:Proposal
Moderna goes up to 65% accuracy at minimum, 70% at optimum.
Moderna goes up to 50-55% stabilization.
Price adjusted accordingly

Even though I'd love a buff to the Moderna, I would absolutely hate it if the buff came at the expense of availability.

But then again Leclerc is allowed to have 70% accuracy with 12 RoF and 22/21 AV and isn't it back to 3 per card again?

I just had to lear again that NSWP counties had almost the technology as USA. Amazing... I just can't figuer out why the civilian indtrustry was so crap... I feel a "bit" inconsisentcy...

This would be also bad change by gameplay wise...

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Re: On T-72M2 Moderna and its FCS.

Postby Sir Typhoon » Thu 12 Jan 2017 16:51

The first "spoiler" is very interesting :D.

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Re: On T-72M2 Moderna and its FCS.

Postby Grabbed_by_the_Spets » Thu 12 Jan 2017 16:58

molnibalage wrote:I just had to lear again that NSWP counties had almost the technology as USA. Amazing... I just can't figuer out why the civilian indtrustry was so crap... I feel a "bit" inconsisentcy...


This would be also bad change by gameplay wise...[/quote]

As opposed to the notion that NSWP was stuck with WW2 technology throughout the cold war?

65-70% is a bit too much IMHO, but a 60% Acc with 55% stab would be much welcome!
Last edited by Grabbed_by_the_Spets on Thu 12 Jan 2017 17:41, edited 1 time in total.
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