Leave no man behind: WGermany

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Re: Leave no man behind: WGermany

Postby Lord Helmchen » Fri 20 Jan 2017 17:31

Capion wrote:
The Tiger isnt the way to go and neither is (apparently) the ECR. Its either INF/TNK/REC or a combination thereof.

One could still go with an increased HOT missile count.
Tbh I'm quite happy with the ECR, it's one of the best SEAD planes ingame.

Jäger should drop to 10 points IMO as I'd say that the advantages do not warrant +5 points. One could still decrease the PzF-44's range to 525m if completely necessary.

I'd like to see a Leopard 2A4 variant with the DM43 aka the dutch one. Which would fill a hole between the 2A4 and the 2A5.

I'd say change the Alpha Jet A to the Alpha Jet KWS armed w/ SNEBs, reroll the Starfighter to a napalm carrier.
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Re: Leave no man behind: WGermany

Postby Razzmann » Fri 20 Jan 2017 17:32

Capion wrote:
CandyMan wrote:Pf44 to 15 ap or less then you can have 10 pt jager.


That would still leave the Jäger under-performing because of their transport. I would like some good units for the deck itself and to contribute to the coalitions, not more mediocre ones. 19 AP Chasseurs '85 with bullpup and 3 AV transport would still arguably be preferable. As I said, this isnt necessarily the change thats needed, their are other possibilities, like the Deckungsgruppe buff.

Let me point out: ATM there are exactly 3 (!) WGerman units that contribute significantly to EC (aka the only reasons to play EC over France). Those are the Leo2A5, the Leo2A4 and PzGren '90 in Marder 2. Additionally the latter two are overall mediocre units which just happen to fill gaps. Of course your are better off taking more German units, but everything else (but those 3) France can cover with only very little compromising. That isnt balance.

Why did they not underperform when they were 10 points then?

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Re: Leave no man behind: WGermany

Postby Sigirdiwarth » Fri 20 Jan 2017 17:33

1v1 between nande playing eurocorps and akkku playing baltic front when? :D
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Re: Leave no man behind: WGermany

Postby Capion » Fri 20 Jan 2017 17:34

Razzmann wrote:
Capion wrote:
CandyMan wrote:Pf44 to 15 ap or less then you can have 10 pt jager.


That would still leave the Jäger under-performing because of their transport. I would like some good units for the deck itself and to contribute to the coalitions, not more mediocre ones. 19 AP Chasseurs '85 with bullpup and 3 AV transport would still arguably be preferable. As I said, this isnt necessarily the change thats needed, their are other possibilities, like the Deckungsgruppe buff.

Let me point out: ATM there are exactly 3 (!) WGerman units that contribute significantly to EC (aka the only reasons to play EC over France). Those are the Leo2A5, the Leo2A4 and PzGren '90 in Marder 2. Additionally the latter two are overall mediocre units which just happen to fill gaps. Of course your are better off taking more German units, but everything else (but those 3) France can cover with only very little compromising. That isnt balance.

Why did they not underperform when they were 10 points then?


??? MG/BR rebalance.
Last edited by Capion on Fri 20 Jan 2017 17:36, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Leave no man behind: WGermany

Postby Razzmann » Fri 20 Jan 2017 17:35

Capion wrote:??? MG/BR rebalance

MG3 line inf is still a lot stronger than infantry with M60 and its stat copies, which is basically the next best MG there is. They win with 5 men left.
Last edited by Razzmann on Fri 20 Jan 2017 17:36, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Leave no man behind: WGermany

Postby Akkku » Fri 20 Jan 2017 17:35

Razzmann wrote:
Capion wrote:
CandyMan wrote:Pf44 to 15 ap or less then you can have 10 pt jager.


That would still leave the Jäger under-performing because of their transport. I would like some good units for the deck itself and to contribute to the coalitions, not more mediocre ones. 19 AP Chasseurs '85 with bullpup and 3 AV transport would still arguably be preferable. As I said, this isnt necessarily the change thats needed, their are other possibilities, like the Deckungsgruppe buff.

Let me point out: ATM there are exactly 3 (!) WGerman units that contribute significantly to EC (aka the only reasons to play EC over France). Those are the Leo2A5, the Leo2A4 and PzGren '90 in Marder 2. Additionally the latter two are overall mediocre units which just happen to fill gaps. Of course your are better off taking more German units, but everything else (but those 3) France can cover with only very little compromising. That isnt balance.

Why did they not underperform when they were 10 points then?

Because they had 16AP and IFVs had lower armour values. On top of that the competing line infantry was not as good as it is now.
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Re: Leave no man behind: WGermany

Postby Lord Helmchen » Fri 20 Jan 2017 17:36

nande wrote:Blindicide for 10pt Jager. It's already better than the Yugoslav M-57A2, having 400 instead of 290 suppression.

PzF-44 changes affect PzGren, and are thus undesirable

M20 Super Bazooka as the Blindicide was never used by the Bundeswehr.
Jäger 85 could then become what the current Jäger are.
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Re: Leave no man behind: WGermany

Postby Capion » Fri 20 Jan 2017 17:37

Razzmann wrote:
Capion wrote:??? MG/BR rebalance

MG3 line inf is still a lot stronger than infantry with M60 and its stat copies, which is basically the next best MG there is. They win with 5 men left.


Not saying they would be bad at 10 pts with low AP btw. Just not the clear assets I would like in WGermany. Maybe under-performing is a litte strongly worded.

Oh, and btw nobody uses standard MG inf unless they come in exellent transports.
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Re: Leave no man behind: WGermany

Postby Ribar » Fri 20 Jan 2017 17:58

WGermany needs good non-radar AA and 1 more superheavy.
> 3 Leo2A5 only for WGer national deck, for flavor.
> Was there any optical Roland used by WGer, like the french one (it has 2800m anti helo range)?
> As for planes : was WGer allowed to have cluster ammunition?
> Where is Starfighter? Didn't WGer have one in ALB as cheap asf? That one could carry clusters?
The rest is fine.
Only thing WGer player should be afraid of is Ka-52/Ka-50 combo, these helicopters represent serious challenge. There is simply no way to beat it efficiently. So AA should be top priority.
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Re: Leave no man behind: WGermany

Postby Razzmann » Fri 20 Jan 2017 18:02

Ribar wrote:> Was there any optical Roland used by WGer, like the french one (it has 2800m anti helo range)?

German Rolands (I would imagine that there is no difference between German and French) had a fully functional non-radar system, not just a back up one like most other radar aa.

Ribar wrote:> As for planes : was WGer allowed to have cluster ammunition?

They had the MW-1, but afaik Eugen dropped it because they could not model it properly.


Ribar wrote:> Where is Starfighter? Didn't WGer have one in ALB as cheap asf? That one could carry clusters?

In the Naval tab.

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