Eugen Stand to make a great deal of money by teaming up with Wargaming

Nerdfish
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Re: Eugen Stand to make a great deal of money by teaming up with Wargaming

Postby Nerdfish » Mon 25 Jun 2018 23:50

XanderTuron wrote:
Nerdfish wrote:It's a spinoff based on the popular 10 v 10 mode. It's not Wargame 4. Wargame 4 will still be deep battle or whatever it will be. The f2p just makes it more probable.

The entire pace of the game would have to be changed in order to keep it within a 15-20 minute time limit, because that's you know, Wargaming's thing, short quick battles. As well, you would probably have to change many mechanics (some for better, most for worse) just to maintain the fast pace and appeal to a very casual audience.


The default game length is 45, and one send tend to have a distinct advantage after 30. Current game paces are fine, especially on smaller maps. As for casual audience, Total War Arena is arguably as complex as Rome 2 in term of combat and nobody seemed to mind. If people can understand the charge mechanics in Arena when they come out of the noob tiers, they can understand WG's spotting system. There will be scrubs, but there are plenty of scrubs at is.

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Re: Eugen Stand to make a great deal of money by teaming up with Wargaming

Postby XanderTuron » Mon 25 Jun 2018 23:56

Nerdfish wrote:The default game length is 45, and one send tend to have a distinct advantage after 30. Current game paces are fine, especially on smaller maps. As for casual audience, Total War Arena is arguably as complex as Rome 2 in term of combat and nobody seemed to mind. If people can understand the charge mechanics in Arena when they come out of the noob tiers, they can understand WG's spotting system. There will be scrubs, but there are plenty of scrubs at is.


Notice how that time length is much greater than 15 or 20 minutes; which means that in order to fit that time limit, the pace would have to be changed. As well, compared to Wargame, Total War has a fairly simple combat system and even then, Total War Arena is still simplified from what you would see in a regular Total War game.
My mouth is moving, but nothing relevant is coming out. Also I cannot guarantee that my research is perfect or even remotely accurate.

I have low quality Wargame Red Dragon casts on my youtube channel https://www.youtube.com/user/XanderTuron

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Re: Eugen Stand to make a great deal of money by teaming up with Wargaming

Postby Nerdfish » Tue 26 Jun 2018 02:15

XanderTuron wrote:
Nerdfish wrote:The default game length is 45, and one send tend to have a distinct advantage after 30. Current game paces are fine, especially on smaller maps. As for casual audience, Total War Arena is arguably as complex as Rome 2 in term of combat and nobody seemed to mind. If people can understand the charge mechanics in Arena when they come out of the noob tiers, they can understand WG's spotting system. There will be scrubs, but there are plenty of scrubs at is.


Notice how that time length is much greater than 15 or 20 minutes; which means that in order to fit that time limit, the pace would have to be changed. As well, compared to Wargame, Total War has a fairly simple combat system and even then, Total War Arena is still simplified from what you would see in a regular Total War game.


In 10 v 10, you can tell who's going to win after 15 or 20 mins, except maybe on Asgard and Strait. So as long as maps are kept small this wouldn't be a problem. I'd have to disagree that total war having a simpler combat system. Units in total war have similar number of stats as WG units (about 20 or so each), they are just grouped up into categories.

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Re: Eugen Stand to make a great deal of money by teaming up with Wargaming

Postby XanderTuron » Tue 26 Jun 2018 09:07

Nerdfish wrote:In 10 v 10, you can tell who's going to win after 15 or 20 mins, except maybe on Asgard and Strait

And? In World of Tanks you can often tell who is going to win after 5 minutes and yet battles will often go to the 15 minute limit. People play Wargaming Games in part because they want a quick, casual match, something that lasts no longer than 15 or 20 minutes. They don't want a battle that has the appearance of one side having the advantage after 15 or 20 minutes; they want a battle that is over after 15 or 20 minutes.

So as long as maps are kept small this wouldn't be a problem.


So your solution is to just turn it into an absolute clusterfuck, or to absolutely gut the Wargame experience by making it a tactical battle (similar to how in TW:A you only control three units)?

I'd have to disagree that total war having a simpler combat system. Units in total war have similar number of stats as WG units (about 20 or so each), they are just grouped up into categories.


Wargame does have a more complex combat system; accuracy scaling, KE scaling, armour facing, guided weapons, smoke screens, RADAR/SEAD interaction, and the supply system just to name a few. Of course some of these are just by dint of Wargame being about modern combat which means that added complexity is a given. However, overall, Wargame is just straight up more complex than Total War.
My mouth is moving, but nothing relevant is coming out. Also I cannot guarantee that my research is perfect or even remotely accurate.

I have low quality Wargame Red Dragon casts on my youtube channel https://www.youtube.com/user/XanderTuron

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Re: Eugen Stand to make a great deal of money by teaming up with Wargaming

Postby Nerdfish » Fri 29 Jun 2018 16:17

XanderTuron wrote:
Nerdfish wrote:In 10 v 10, you can tell who's going to win after 15 or 20 mins, except maybe on Asgard and Strait

And? In World of Tanks you can often tell who is going to win after 5 minutes and yet battles will often go to the 15 minute limit. People play Wargaming Games in part because they want a quick, casual match, something that lasts no longer than 15 or 20 minutes. They don't want a battle that has the appearance of one side having the advantage after 15 or 20 minutes; they want a battle that is over after 15 or 20 minutes.

So as long as maps are kept small this wouldn't be a problem.


So your solution is to just turn it into an absolute clusterfuck, or to absolutely gut the Wargame experience by making it a tactical battle (similar to how in TW:A you only control three units)?


The time limit is a victory condition in WG. The goal is usually to have a higher score than the other team when the time run out. It's rare for one team to roll the other one off the map in WG anyway. Because of this a WG match can have arbitrary length. Random and coop battle can have 20 min limit because the goal is to farm kills anyway. Ranked and Clan battles can have longer time limit - 45 to 60 mins, because winning actually matters in those.

Wargame does have a more complex combat system; accuracy scaling, KE scaling, armour facing, guided weapons, smoke screens, RADAR/SEAD interaction, and the supply system just to name a few. Of course some of these are just by dint of Wargame being about modern combat which means that added complexity is a given. However, overall, Wargame is just straight up more complex than Total War.


Arguable, there are many interacting systems in TW as well: melee attack vs defence, melee damage and AP vs body and shield armour, bonus vs. cavalry, elephant, infantry, etc etc, charge impact vs charge deflect, flanking morale damage and that's just melee.

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Re: Eugen Stand to make a great deal of money by teaming up with Wargaming

Postby chykka » Fri 20 Jul 2018 08:43

XanderTuron wrote:
Nerdfish wrote:It's a spinoff based on the popular 10 v 10 mode. It's not Wargame 4. Wargame 4 will still be deep battle or whatever it will be. The f2p just makes it more probable.

The entire pace of the game would have to be changed in order to keep it within a 15-20 minute time limit, because that's you know, Wargaming's thing, short quick battles. As well, you would probably have to change many mechanics (some for better, most for worse) just to maintain the fast pace and appeal to a very casual audience.


shorter rounds would appeal to more people. You'd have to maybe make maps and objectives smaller or simpler. With less defensable terrain. Not for current audience though. To be fair most 10v10 's are an hour long.
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Re: Eugen Stand to make a great deal of money by teaming up with Wargaming

Postby Nerdfish » Fri 27 Jul 2018 04:25

chykka wrote:
XanderTuron wrote:
Nerdfish wrote:It's a spinoff based on the popular 10 v 10 mode. It's not Wargame 4. Wargame 4 will still be deep battle or whatever it will be. The f2p just makes it more probable.

The entire pace of the game would have to be changed in order to keep it within a 15-20 minute time limit, because that's you know, Wargaming's thing, short quick battles. As well, you would probably have to change many mechanics (some for better, most for worse) just to maintain the fast pace and appeal to a very casual audience.


shorter rounds would appeal to more people. You'd have to maybe make maps and objectives smaller or simpler. With less defensable terrain. Not for current audience though. To be fair most 10v10 's are an hour long.


You mean most 10 v 10s are not an hour long ?


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Re: Eugen Stand to make a great deal of money by teaming up with Wargaming

Postby aradralami » Fri 8 Nov 2019 21:13

Nerdfish wrote:This could happen. :lol:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvPXuMMI8yg
/necromancy

Why the rocket sound at 0:15 is very similar to the one from War Thunder... In fact it's the one from War Thunder

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Re: Eugen Stand to make a great deal of money by teaming up with Wargaming

Postby seluzerkharix » Sun 15 Dec 2019 07:37

Nerdfish wrote:Heard Eugen had some money trouble with strikes and all, so I am going to contribute productively by coming up with a solution.

Having played some total war arena (10 v 10 RTT), I realized Eugen already have a working 10 V 10 RTT game in RD. They just need to join wargaming alliance (creative assembly and wargaming), and hand the matchmaking and money making to the WOT people, who's basically rolling in beds of gold. This Kills two birds with one stone, first it eliminates the teamstacking / matchmaking issue persistent in WG series, and make a ton of money to pay their interns.

The setup can be the same as Arena. You join the game with a deck and the highest tier unit in the deck determines your MM Tier. Since Category already exist in WG, it could be turned into (approx) 5 year (tiers) with tier I at 1960 and tier X at 2100. Prototypes turns into premium units and there's your endless cashcow. You can even do limited time sales with ATACMS.

Of course some people are going to hate you for it, but people will hate you anyway :lol: .
I think one of the big problems that Eugen continues to face, administratively, is a serious deficit in 'soft skills'. It seems like the studio was just never very interested in investing in the non-tech side of things – writing, artists, voice acting, community support and moderation, etc. I suspect that the mentality was something along the lines of 'We don't need professional story writers; we can just get one of our engineers to do it!'

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