Modding RD

User avatar
jubedy
Command Sergeant Major
Posts: 333
Joined: Wed 27 Mar 2013 04:23
Location: Location Location
Contact:

Re: Modding RD

Postby jubedy » Mon 7 Apr 2014 23:21

How do you plan on implementing 8, 10, planes apparently not evacing anymore?
Image
Spoiler : :
Image

Mot
Second-Lieutenant
Posts: 955
Joined: Mon 21 Jan 2013 17:00
Contact:

Re: Modding RD

Postby Mot » Tue 8 Apr 2014 00:21

Corsair wrote:@Mot

Autoloaders? :)


EVERYTHING!!!

If its not hard to simulate, sure.

jimvajicka wrote:i hope i will change values to make this game more realistic (Balance, for example m113 ADST real life range = 15 km)


Well there's two problems with full realism:
The maps are too small, so a lot of units are pointless, including air combat UNLESS that's your point. Should be fun either way.
The screen is too small for the sheer awesomeness of Apaches firing hellfires 8km away...

jubedy wrote:How do you plan on implementing 8, 10, planes apparently not evacing anymore?


They evac, but they might take 1 minute to do so, basically its a counter to get out of jail free card airplanes enjoy...
Evacing in the middile of enemy AA area will mean death most likely, instead players have to get the plane out of that area and then evac safely. But keep in mind that airplanes won't have to go so far into enemy AA area to deliver payload, ranges for anti-ground missiles will be increased probably by a factor of 2.
"I suck at Wargame" or "I have to wait 30 minutes to pubstomp people" are not solid arguments to criticize the game... just saying.

User avatar
The W:AB Noob
Lieutenant General
Posts: 4538
Joined: Fri 12 Jul 2013 22:29
Location: United States, Central Time Zone
Contact:

Re: Modding RD

Postby The W:AB Noob » Tue 8 Apr 2014 04:31

Mot wrote:
Corsair wrote:@Mot

Autoloaders? :)


EVERYTHING!!!

If its not hard to simulate, sure.

jimvajicka wrote:i hope i will change values to make this game more realistic (Balance, for example m113 ADST real life range = 15 km)


Well there's two problems with full realism:
The maps are too small, so a lot of units are pointless, including air combat UNLESS that's your point. Should be fun either way.
The screen is too small for the sheer awesomeness of Apaches firing hellfires 8km away...

jubedy wrote:How do you plan on implementing 8, 10, planes apparently not evacing anymore?


They evac, but they might take 1 minute to do so, basically its a counter to get out of jail free card airplanes enjoy...
Evacing in the middile of enemy AA area will mean death most likely, instead players have to get the plane out of that area and then evac safely. But keep in mind that airplanes won't have to go so far into enemy AA area to deliver payload, ranges for anti-ground missiles will be increased probably by a factor of 2.


Couple things:
Maps are not too small. They are pretty huge if put in the right scale. For full realism, change the MultiplicateurMetreRTSVersDistanceFeedbackTactique from 3.5 to 0.1 The area of the map is really 12.25 times bigger than you are used to.

The screen is too small? What is that supposed to mean? There are plenty of realistic military games (Project Reality, Digital Combat Simulator, ARMA if you count it) which have no problems with the average PC screen.

You can also change the category of any plane to 2. Doing this will give it the normal buttons, but once you evac, it's gone forever. This makes it more like air strikes than reusable planes.
W:RD Sandbox Mod 5.4.2, the Final and Ultimate Patch Click -> Image

Mot
Second-Lieutenant
Posts: 955
Joined: Mon 21 Jan 2013 17:00
Contact:

Re: Modding RD

Postby Mot » Tue 8 Apr 2014 23:09

The W:AB Noob wrote:Couple things:
Maps are not too small. They are pretty huge if put in the right scale. For full realism, change the MultiplicateurMetreRTSVersDistanceFeedbackTactique from 3.5 to 0.1 The area of the map is really 12.25 times bigger than you are used to.


Wait a minute, isn't that the other way around? :p
In WALB the range scale was increased by a factor of 2.5, you could set it to 1.0 to get real scaled ranges, basically making the map 2.5 times smaller, not bigger.
I value some sense of range, 2.5 isn't bad, but when I modded WALB 1.0 felt really good, but the maps were prohibitively small for the amount of units a game usually had, but for low points games it was beautiful.

The W:AB Noob wrote:The screen is too small? What is that supposed to mean? There are plenty of realistic military games (Project Reality, Digital Combat Simulator, ARMA if you count it) which have no problems with the average PC screen.

Yes but this is a strategy game where you control units on a large landscape, if you give units realistic ranges, to get a sense of what is going on, you either have to play on satellite view, or you have to scroll the map constantly, it just doesn't feel good IN MY OPINION of course.

The W:AB Noob wrote:You can also change the category of any plane to 2. Doing this will give it the normal buttons, but once you evac, it's gone forever. This makes it more like air strikes than reusable planes.

Now that's amazing news, I wanted my mod to preferably be able to use planes once only, but due to units occupying the limited Air Comm space I thought it was impossible, but if you can make planes just disappear, that's amazing!
"I suck at Wargame" or "I have to wait 30 minutes to pubstomp people" are not solid arguments to criticize the game... just saying.

User avatar
The W:AB Noob
Lieutenant General
Posts: 4538
Joined: Fri 12 Jul 2013 22:29
Location: United States, Central Time Zone
Contact:

Re: Modding RD

Postby The W:AB Noob » Wed 9 Apr 2014 00:58

Mot wrote:
The W:AB Noob wrote:Maps are not too small. They are pretty huge if put in the right scale. For full realism, change the MultiplicateurMetreRTSVersDistanceFeedbackTactique from 3.5 to 0.1 The area of the map is really 12.25 times bigger than you are used to.



Wait a minute, isn't that the other way around? :p
In WALB the range scale was increased by a factor of 2.5, you could set it to 1.0 to get real scaled ranges, basically making the map 2.5 times smaller, not bigger.
I value some sense of range, 2.5 isn't bad, but when I modded WALB 1.0 felt really good, but the maps were prohibitively small for the amount of units a game usually had, but for low points games it was beautiful.


eMeM wrote:Did anyone try changing MultiplicateurMetreRTSVersDistanceFeedbackTactique? It's in gdconstanteoriginal.ndfbin
Default is 0.35.


RaduM wrote:Very interesting. For my mod, I think I will use a value of 0.1 . The reason is that value seems to best correspond to "real life". At a value of 0.1 the "attack ground" (default key "T") rangerfinder says that a US M35 truck has a length of 7 meters. That is exactly the length of the USA M35 truck in real-life.

So for those of you that want to mod W:ALB in a more realistic direction a value of 0.1 seems ideal.


So in context, maps will be 3.5 times larger in length, and 3.5 times larger in width, from the numbers on the screen, and nothing gameplay-wise will change. Now, you can say your maps are 18.37 square km, though it will not really do anything.

Plus, naizarak proved in the map unlocker mod that you can unlock 10 vs 10 maps. So if that's not enough for you... :D

Mot wrote:
The W:AB Noob wrote:The screen is too small? What is that supposed to mean? There are plenty of realistic military games (Project Reality, Digital Combat Simulator, ARMA if you count it) which have no problems with the average PC screen.


Yes but this is a strategy game where you control units on a large landscape, if you give units realistic ranges, to get a sense of what is going on, you either have to play on satellite view, or you have to scroll the map constantly, it just doesn't feel good IN MY OPINION of course.


Ok, I get your point now, I didn't understand before. Well there is not too much we can do about it, and realistically, I believe the communication situation on the real battlefields would be a lot worse than what you see now.

Mot wrote:
The W:AB Noob wrote:You can also change the category of any plane to 2. Doing this will give it the normal buttons, but once you evac, it's gone forever. This makes it more like air strikes than reusable planes.


Now that's amazing news, I wanted my mod to preferably be able to use planes once only, but due to units occupying the limited Air Comm space I thought it was impossible, but if you can make planes just disappear, that's amazing!


I forgot if the game crashed or not after I quit that game session, just be really careful. Also, when you send your airstrike over, the money spent AND the plane disappear forever.
W:RD Sandbox Mod 5.4.2, the Final and Ultimate Patch Click -> Image

User avatar
COMThing
Sergeant Major of the Army
Posts: 390
Joined: Sat 7 Apr 2012 11:54
Location: NZ
Contact:

Re: Modding RD

Postby COMThing » Wed 9 Apr 2014 02:27

Mot wrote:
Corsair wrote:@Mot

Autoloaders? :)


EVERYTHING!!!

If its not hard to simulate, sure.


Auto-loaders can be simulated by having 1 salvo containing the full amount of ammunition. As far as I'm aware the time between shots is not affected by veterancy or morale, only the time between salvos.

Mot
Second-Lieutenant
Posts: 955
Joined: Mon 21 Jan 2013 17:00
Contact:

Re: Modding RD

Postby Mot » Wed 9 Apr 2014 13:55

I modded artillery in WALB to fire continuously by using that "technique" that can be used to simulate autoloader, sounds good, any known setback from using it?

About the planes, I guess it will be trial and error, but having planes evacuate and disappear would be just perfect for what I have in mind, just perfect, however I doubt the AI will be able to adapt to that reality.
"I suck at Wargame" or "I have to wait 30 minutes to pubstomp people" are not solid arguments to criticize the game... just saying.

User avatar
COMThing
Sergeant Major of the Army
Posts: 390
Joined: Sat 7 Apr 2012 11:54
Location: NZ
Contact:

Re: Modding RD

Postby COMThing » Wed 9 Apr 2014 14:26

Mot wrote:I modded artillery in WALB to fire continuously by using that "technique" that can be used to simulate autoloader, sounds good, any known setback from using it?

About the planes, I guess it will be trial and error, but having planes evacuate and disappear would be just perfect for what I have in mind, just perfect, however I doubt the AI will be able to adapt to that reality.


I not sure whether this is still the case but in some versions of ALB the supply units only seemed to supply in salvos, so with this autoloading technique, you would have to wait for the vehicle to run out of ammo completely. Other than that I'm unaware of any setbacks.

User avatar
Elouda
Master Sergeant
Posts: 150
Joined: Mon 15 Apr 2013 01:43
Location: Helsinki, Finland
Contact:

Re: Modding RD

Postby Elouda » Wed 9 Apr 2014 23:08

Hmm, interesting things I've done as part of testing or proof of concept...

F-15E with AGM-130.

F/A-18A+ with 8xAIM120 and 2xAIM9.

A-7E with Walleye I ER/DL - tested as both a 'guided HEAT bomb' and as a regular guided HE bomb. Settled for the latter.

F-4S with Mk4 gun pod and full 4/4 AIM9/AIM7 loadout.

Making SALH ATGMs like the Svir able to fire on the move - works, but wont be using it as without an ability to slow down reverse speeds they end up way too OP. Might look into making them anti-helo capable at shorter ranges.

Making large (ie non RPG/LAW) HEAT and KE rounds do double damage on penetration - works, will probably be using this to make armoured combat appropriately lethal.

Redesign of tank-busting aircraft guns like the GAU-8 to use KE and only work from side/rear - done and works flawlessly.

Experiments with changing infantry squads to 4/6/8 from 5/10/15 - works, but need to figure out how to adjust and spread the formations.

Addition of CAT D (pre 1975). This one is a lot of work, so hope Eugen will return CAT D for us...

COMThing wrote:
Mot wrote:I modded artillery in WALB to fire continuously by using that "technique" that can be used to simulate autoloader, sounds good, any known setback from using it?

About the planes, I guess it will be trial and error, but having planes evacuate and disappear would be just perfect for what I have in mind, just perfect, however I doubt the AI will be able to adapt to that reality.


I not sure whether this is still the case but in some versions of ALB the supply units only seemed to supply in salvos, so with this autoloading technique, you would have to wait for the vehicle to run out of ammo completely. Other than that I'm unaware of any setbacks.


You can also do 'autoloaders' by altering the effect different suppression levels have on the units RoF, as these are unit specific. Its more work, but on the other hand should avoid issues like that, and in addition mean you can do intermediate stages.

For example when testing stuff for an eventual mod I set Autoloaders to only suffer 25% of the RoF penalty compared to regular tanks, in return for a lower base rate of fire. It worked just fine.

User avatar
The W:AB Noob
Lieutenant General
Posts: 4538
Joined: Fri 12 Jul 2013 22:29
Location: United States, Central Time Zone
Contact:

Re: Modding RD

Postby The W:AB Noob » Thu 10 Apr 2014 03:00

Very impressive!
How did you make AGM-130's and expecially the gun pod???
And what about the Cat D? How do you set year limits for decks?
W:RD Sandbox Mod 5.4.2, the Final and Ultimate Patch Click -> Image

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests