AA Modding

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Mikeboy
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AA Modding

Postby Mikeboy » Fri 30 May 2014 19:05

Seeing as interest has been expressed on this topic by a number of different people, though I'd make a thread for us to collectively talk about changing AA, planes, helicopters and everything related.

Firstly there's Iris' suggestion on plane altitudes.

As far as how this related to AA it could mean high altitude bombers that can fly above MANPADs. Perhaps anyway, what we need to establish is if range is 3D or calculated on a 2D plane. It seemed to me the latter was the case in ALB, but we'd need to test to be sure. We may also be able to combine this with changed fire angles, as Xeno summarises.

Xeno426 wrote:On a side note, I've been talking with Iris and he did some tests with aircraft, and came up with some very intriguing possibilities. It would seem that weapons exist within a 3D bubble, so if you set the altitude of an aircraft to round 2200 meters, they will be immune to MANPADS. This could very well give people a reason to take radar SAM systems.

Furthermore, there might be a way to set a minimum angle for weapon engagement, which could be used to prevent radar SAM systems from shooting at low-flying targets if they are still rather far away, allowing for aircraft like the F-111, Tornado and Su-24 to fly "below the radar" and giving people a reason to put AAA or IR-SAM systems near their radar system to provide full coverage... like in real life.

Oh, the possibilities!


Iris has also shown his editing helicopter heights to make them skim the treetops, the only real question is if it means extensive clipping through trees.


Iris wrote:
Mikeboy wrote:Doesn't this cause the problem of it happily flying through trees?


I believe it barely skirts the top of them iirc, but otherwise it's not too visually hampering. It's not nearly as bad as planes through mountains and a bunch of other issues. If I recall in top down you barely notice, and in close-up it seemed minimal. I'd have to recheck how bad it was.


Adding ECM for helicopters is easy, change it the same as planes, here's my ECM list for ALB (which is based on gameplay not realism).
Spoiler : :
Lynx AH.7 Bad
Kiowa Warrior Bad
Puma Bad
AH-1E Bad
Mi-8TV Bad
Mi-17 Medium
Sea Cobra Medium
Sea Hawk Medium
Chinook Medium
Ka-29 Medium
Blackhawk Medium
Sokol Medium
AH-1F Medium
Mi-28 Good
Ka-50 Good
SuperCobra Good
AH-64 V. Good

What hasn't been attempted yet as far as I know is giving them flare effects. May well be possible.

As far as I'm aware the URALGRAZNOMOD team don't have any planes to change mechanics, but do aim to place AA in several distinct bands, which are explained here, with provisional stats here.

My own take on ranges are here, however those suggested are kept within Eugen's system and are merely (mostly) consistent. What I'd like to do is increase them all by a notch or two but also add in new mechanics.

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Re: AA Modding

Postby orcbuster » Fri 30 May 2014 21:43

I'm pretty sure weapons functioned in a 3d bubble in ALB as well. I have distinct memories of aiming AA at it with the range indicator pointing upwards.
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Re: AA Modding

Postby Mikeboy » Fri 30 May 2014 21:53

orcbuster wrote:I'm pretty sure weapons functioned in a 3d bubble in ALB as well. I have distinct memories of aiming AA at it with the range indicator pointing upwards.


I reached that conclusion from ATGM planes, which didn't seem to lose range when they had their altitude increased. However that was just an eyeballed assumption, I didn't test it.

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Re: AA Modding

Postby stratmania » Sun 1 Jun 2014 07:30

orcbuster wrote:I'm pretty sure weapons functioned in a 3d bubble in ALB as well. I have distinct memories of aiming AA at it with the range indicator pointing upwards.

This, and that while evaccing, the distance remained the same due to the target flying up and getting closer to the MANPAD in terms of horizontal distance.

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Re: AA Modding

Postby COMThing » Sun 1 Jun 2014 11:20

Mikeboy wrote:
orcbuster wrote:I'm pretty sure weapons functioned in a 3d bubble in ALB as well. I have distinct memories of aiming AA at it with the range indicator pointing upwards.


I reached that conclusion from ATGM planes, which didn't seem to lose range when they had their altitude increased. However that was just an eyeballed assumption, I didn't test it.


An air launched missile will gain effective range when launched from higher altitudes in a lot of cases, so the ATGM planes not losing range is at least a realistic thing.

I also tried adding flares to helicopters a while ago without success, but now that we can edit vectors maybe that has changed.

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Re: AA Modding

Postby Mikeboy » Sun 1 Jun 2014 15:20

Can confirm that weapons are 3D. No AA was able to fire on this Aardvark at 10x regular altitude. However even at this ridiculous altitude ASFs could intercept.

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Re: AA Modding

Postby The W:AB Noob » Sun 1 Jun 2014 16:20

Mikeboy wrote:Can confirm that weapons are 3D. No AA was able to fire on this Aardvark at 10x regular altitude. However even at this ridiculous altitude ASFs could intercept.

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Of course AA is 3D. Did you think it was just a cylinder?
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Re: AA Modding

Postby Mikeboy » Sun 1 Jun 2014 16:33

The W:AB Noob wrote:Of course AA is 3D. Did you think it was just a cylinder?


Might have been the case that range operated on a 2D plane, that's what both and I and Vasily used to think.

Mikeboy wrote:I reached that conclusion from ATGM planes, which didn't seem to lose range when they had their altitude increased. However that was just an eyeballed assumption, I didn't test it.

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