More effective Tools /Interface

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homerfcb
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More effective Tools /Interface

Postby homerfcb » Sat 6 Sep 2014 11:58

Just a short question: Does anybody, especially the pepole responsible for the modding tool think, it's possible to link it to an easier Interface ?
The existing Tools are great and I would have never been able to encode the game data. You can do nearly everything with the Tools, but with over 1500 units it takes much much time to make big changes. For example if you want to rebalance all tank Prices(for example all should cost -5) you have to through over 400 units and set the Price manually. Automated Options where you could set a new Price like "Prices" "tanks" "tanks cheaper than" "60 Points" would make modding more easier. Moreover a new Interface could actually translate the daabase values into ingame values, meaning that ranges are displayed as they are displayed ingame and that you can see all important unit stats and weapons stats on one page.
I would realize such an Interface in C#, but I honestly don't know how to link it with the current Tools...
The big nerf whiners thread, much controversal stuff, some suggestions and some more stuff, also with a big Patriot range explanation Just klick me, or go here viewtopic.php?f=155&t=48184

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The W:AB Noob
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Re: More effective Tools /Interface

Postby The W:AB Noob » Sat 6 Sep 2014 16:44

homerfcb wrote:Just a short question: Does anybody, especially the pepole responsible for the modding tool think, it's possible to link it to an easier Interface ?
The existing Tools are great and I would have never been able to encode the game data. You can do nearly everything with the Tools, but with over 1500 units it takes much much time to make big changes. For example if you want to rebalance all tank Prices(for example all should cost -5) you have to through over 400 units and set the Price manually. Automated Options where you could set a new Price like "Prices" "tanks" "tanks cheaper than" "60 Points" would make modding more easier. Moreover a new Interface could actually translate the daabase values into ingame values, meaning that ranges are displayed as they are displayed ingame and that you can see all important unit stats and weapons stats on one page.
I would realize such an Interface in C#, but I honestly don't know how to link it with the current Tools...


Probably not, there is still more tools for Hob_Gadlin and Enohka to make, such as a model or map modding tool. I'll let them confirm though.
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Re: More effective Tools /Interface

Postby ShanRevan » Sat 6 Sep 2014 20:24

It's definitely possible, for Uralgraznomod we use a private tool, in which we save our changes in XML and then run a commandline tool which goes through and makes all the edits. Sadly it's not currently available to the public, but working on that.

Rather the question is finding someone to make it. That being said, the way the data is stored, and the often sheer amount of it, does not make it an easy thing to neatly display in a GUI for editing as you desire. Goodluck however.

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Re: More effective Tools /Interface

Postby Darkmil » Sat 6 Sep 2014 20:29

ShanRevan wrote:It's definitely possible, for Uralgraznomod we use a private tool, in which we save our changes in XML and then run a commandline tool which goes through and makes all the edits. Sadly it's not currently available to the public, but working on that.

Rather the question is finding someone to make it. That being said, the way the data is stored, and the often sheer amount of it, does not make it an easy thing to neatly display in a GUI for editing as you desire. Goodluck however.

I could try something for the interface. (From your XML file obviously, I can't understand the NDFBin (even with the source code of the WMS))
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Re: More effective Tools /Interface

Postby Vasto » Sat 6 Sep 2014 22:47

I guess that instead of swapping moddingSuite UI, a better thing might be to build a new application which would offer more specialized and high level functionality for editing NDF files. Source code is available, and you "just" would need to understand how the reading/writing and whole EDAT and NDF models work. After that it would be up to you to decide how to interpret these data and on which level of abstraction you want to present them to the user. Of course it would require some effort and time to build more specialized tool, but it is definitely possible.
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homerfcb
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Re: More effective Tools /Interface

Postby homerfcb » Sun 7 Sep 2014 21:32

The XML part is very interesting. This is for sure a point, where one can start.
I would like to make a tool as easy as possible. Two possible Windows, one where you can make mass changes , the other one where you see something like an editable unit Card. This tool should be only able to change unit stats. For the detailed stuff, as damage Multipliers, decks s.o. the Modding Suite is the best way to go...
Fortunately, I have some free time in the next weeks, as I've finishe my Project work and I have some week until I have to go to my University again. 8 hours of work everyday are still something , but at least my free time is now free...
So if anybody would like to join, I would like to start the development of such Software. I'm not a professional programmer by any means, but I have some experiences, especially in extracting and editing data, so I normally achieve my Goal, maybe not in the finest or most professional ways, but with the help of someone, or even some more Person, I'm sure we can create something great. And if I look at how much time eugen needs to Change Little things, we can achieve a tool that is far more efficient than Eugen's one :D
The big nerf whiners thread, much controversal stuff, some suggestions and some more stuff, also with a big Patriot range explanation Just klick me, or go here viewtopic.php?f=155&t=48184

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Re: More effective Tools /Interface

Postby Hob_Gadling » Mon 8 Sep 2014 03:42

This was a good idea so I went and did it. Now I can reprice and -avail stuff from an Excel sheet. Thanks!

Here's a proof of concept mod made with the tools. Uralgraznomod 1.7 with tank prices divided by 2,6 and availabilities increased by 1,4. Because you can never have enough tanks. I should do the same for infantry, but in reverse, and see how it plays.

http://hobmod.com/loadsatanks/NDF_Win.dat

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homerfcb
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Re: More effective Tools /Interface

Postby homerfcb » Thu 11 Sep 2014 17:41

Hob_Gadling wrote:This was a good idea so I went and did it. Now I can reprice and -avail stuff from an Excel sheet. Thanks!

Here's a proof of concept mod made with the tools. Uralgraznomod 1.7 with tank prices divided by 2,6 and availabilities increased by 1,4. Because you can never have enough tanks. I should do the same for infantry, but in reverse, and see how it plays.

http://hobmod.com/loadsatanks/NDF_Win.dat

That sounds quite cool. I would like to have such options with a interface. From my experience Excel is a very bad data management system. But if you are able to change everything with an excelsheet, it would be quite easy for me to make an interface for it, as Excel is quite accessible...
The big nerf whiners thread, much controversal stuff, some suggestions and some more stuff, also with a big Patriot range explanation Just klick me, or go here viewtopic.php?f=155&t=48184

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Re: More effective Tools /Interface

Postby Ceiling_Matt » Mon 15 Sep 2014 09:30

this sounds like it'd save quite a few open windows, any hope for a release? :mrgreen:

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Re: More effective Tools /Interface

Postby homerfcb » Tue 16 Sep 2014 20:43

Ceiling_Matt wrote:this sounds like it'd save quite a few open windows, any hope for a release? :mrgreen:

This is quite possible, if just any helps me with accessing the Data base. I'll maybe start with the interface an upload some pictures. Maybe, this would encourage some people to join this project...
The big nerf whiners thread, much controversal stuff, some suggestions and some more stuff, also with a big Patriot range explanation Just klick me, or go here viewtopic.php?f=155&t=48184

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