Un-nerf SEAD and Cluster

Tindahbawx
Corporal
Posts: 42
Joined: Mon 27 Feb 2012 15:17
Contact:

Re: Un-nerf SEAD and Cluster

Postby Tindahbawx » Thu 16 May 2013 14:44

QShadow wrote:Those AA guns are also radar, germany has no NON-radar aa.


Yes it does, the cheaper Flakpanzer is non-AA. I use it in my West German deck.

Its a bit crap though, short range. Only way I've found to use it effectively is to park one, then park a RAD Gepard 2500m further back from it. Once an SEAD plane comes in for the Gepard, the non-RAD AA opens up on it, and usually stuns it, hopefully before it launches its missile, at which point the Depard can chew it up.

But yeah, W-Germany needs some MANPADs. :(

tiago
Captain
Posts: 1667
Joined: Wed 22 Feb 2012 16:14
Contact:

Re: Un-nerf SEAD and Cluster

Postby tiago » Thu 16 May 2013 15:07

I find amuzing how peopel dare to sayu cluster bombs were only good thing against pact tanks. I agree that cluster bombs shoudl return a bit to like they were (but not all).


But only viable option? LOL

Why NATOplayers still refuse to use the weaposn taht Nato decided woudl stop Soviet tanks? The ATGM helicopters?


Amazing how few times I saw people usign Ah64 and usign mortars and arti to cover them from clsoe range AA. AH-64 can murder t-80 liek if they were child in bycicles.

solaris
Lieutenant
Posts: 1400
Joined: Mon 13 May 2013 06:10
Contact:

Re: Un-nerf SEAD and Cluster

Postby solaris » Thu 16 May 2013 15:21

tiago wrote:Why NATOplayers still refuse to use the weaposn taht Nato decided woudl stop Soviet tanks? The ATGM helicopters?


Nato ATGMs are, at maximum, ranged 2800m. You must have full line of sight, and you must carefully manage your helos so they don't shoot eight HOT-2s at the same base model T-55. That's assuming you don't get wrecked by one of Pact's SAM systems, the majority of which have a range greater than 2800m. A single Buk missile will kill both Apaches if they are flying in formation.

Helicopters are not a viable option to stop a rush. They are selectively useful if the Pact player has neglected his air cover, but even then, it is better to use an airplane that does not drain hundreds of valuable supply points.
Anecdotes do not count for game balance.

stray cat
Staff Sergeant
Posts: 80
Joined: Tue 30 Apr 2013 19:05
Contact:

Re: Un-nerf SEAD and Cluster

Postby stray cat » Thu 16 May 2013 15:22

Nato ATGMs are, at maximum, ranged 2800m. You must have full line of sight, and you must carefully manage your helos so they don't shoot eight HOT-2s at the same base model T-55. That's assuming you don't get wrecked by one of Pact's SAM systems, the majority of which have a range greater than 2800m. A single Buk missile will kill both Apaches if they are flying in formation.

Helicopters are not a viable option to stop a rush. They are selectively useful if the Pact player has neglected his air cover, but even then, it is better to use an airplane that does not drain hundreds of valuable supply points.



Wrong. Hellfire missiles are F&F.

Againt this proves that lack of experience causes wrong assumptions about game balance.

solaris
Lieutenant
Posts: 1400
Joined: Mon 13 May 2013 06:10
Contact:

Re: Un-nerf SEAD and Cluster

Postby solaris » Thu 16 May 2013 15:27

stray cat wrote:Wrong. Hellfire missiles are F&F.

Againt this proves that lack of experience causes wrong assumptions about game balance.


What does being Fire and Forget have to do with any of this? Pact SAM systems generally outrange the Hellfire to begin with, so even if it can get into position, stop and stabilize, and rifle off a Hellfire, if there are any SAMs in range, they will kill the Apache before it can fire off a second, which means that you get to kill a single (probably 60-100 point) tank in exchange for your helo, and that's assuming you're not shot down before you get your shot off. If you do encounter a rush with Apaches, they will fire at the same targets, sometimes firing a second missile while the first is still in flight, which will then fly into the ground after the first missile hits.

Helicopters are not the answer right now.
Anecdotes do not count for game balance.

OmikronAnubis
Sergeant
Posts: 78
Joined: Mon 27 Feb 2012 19:42
Contact:

Re: Un-nerf SEAD and Cluster

Postby OmikronAnubis » Thu 16 May 2013 15:34

Neither Tunguskas nor Buks and Kubs are able to shoot while moving. If there is a rush these units (if the enemys brings them so far to the front acutally) will move or be not so close to the front. And if there are Buks, use your ravens, artillery, caketrower, whatever. Do you espect as Pact to overrun the enemy just with 2 T80U?

Kin-Luu
Captain
Posts: 1687
Joined: Sat 10 Mar 2012 10:45
Contact:

Re: Un-nerf SEAD and Cluster

Postby Kin-Luu » Thu 16 May 2013 15:36

OmikronAnubis wrote:Neither Tunguskas nor Buks and Kubs are able to shoot while moving. If there is a rush these units (if the enemys brings them so far to the front acutally) will move or be not so close to the front. And if there are Buks, use your ravens, artillery, caketrower, whatever. Do you espect as Pact to overrun the enemy just with 2 T80U?


Tunguska-M has stabs.
Image

Yermo
Specialist
Posts: 13
Joined: Sun 28 Apr 2013 21:09
Contact:

Re: Un-nerf SEAD and Cluster

Postby Yermo » Thu 16 May 2013 16:09

OmikronAnubis wrote:Neither Tunguskas nor Buks and Kubs are able to shoot while moving. If there is a rush these units (if the enemys brings them so far to the front acutally) will move or be not so close to the front. And if there are Buks, use your ravens, artillery, caketrower, whatever. Do you espect as Pact to overrun the enemy just with 2 T80U?


Yeah because Pact only advance in rush, that's right.

Stop playing against AI or noob players, THEN come to the forum and comment !

A good Pact player will advance carefully : destroy the ATGM vehicles with arti (yes stray cat, I know, I'm a moron cause I had to anticipate where the arti would fall and move my vehicles) or even a Buratino, then send his heavy tanks and of course his recon covered by some AA ! So your little AH64 will more likely be destroyed before getting in range !

So noooow you could use some damn planes, but guess what ? Your damn A10/Hornet/whatever will fire 1 missile at the first run, then get shot down by the AA, your clusters planes are useless and all you can do is "Defend in depth" !
Last edited by OpusTheFowl on Thu 16 May 2013 17:24, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Language

stray cat
Staff Sergeant
Posts: 80
Joined: Tue 30 Apr 2013 19:05
Contact:

Re: Un-nerf SEAD and Cluster

Postby stray cat » Thu 16 May 2013 16:11

Your AA is dead before attacking me

solaris
Lieutenant
Posts: 1400
Joined: Mon 13 May 2013 06:10
Contact:

Re: Un-nerf SEAD and Cluster

Postby solaris » Thu 16 May 2013 16:19

stray cat wrote:Your AA is dead before attacking me


His might be, but since I have mastered the arcane art of micromanagment, mine is doing just fine, and I only toggle it on when I estimate it has a greater than 75% chance to kill a target or two. SEAD has never been a threat to a player who pays attention.
Anecdotes do not count for game balance.

Return to “Wargame : AirLand Battle”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 18 guests