Battle time limit needs adjusting!

User avatar
DeuZerre
More than 10 000 messages. Soldier you are the leader of all armies!
Posts: 11125
Joined: Mon 27 Feb 2012 23:17
Location: Universe, Galaxy, Solar System, Earth, Ground, Eurasian Continent, Main Landmass.
Contact:

Re: Battle time limit needs adjusting!

Postby DeuZerre » Thu 11 Jul 2013 15:05

It's not a super cheat mode! It's playing the way I want it, with the options I wanted. Why didn't the dev put a rocket launcher in the crashed pod at the start? They should have, so the player could chose between all the weapons in the game to play the way he wants this start of the campaign.
Image
Marshal honoris causa
FLX wrote:Removing the weaknesses from the divisions leads to all divisions being the same in the long run. We won't proceed like that.

User avatar
TheFunnyOne1125
First Sergeant
Posts: 241
Joined: Thu 30 May 2013 15:38
Location: Austin, Texas
Contact:

Re: Battle time limit needs adjusting!

Postby TheFunnyOne1125 » Fri 12 Jul 2013 04:23

crazyewok wrote:BS

Were are not asking for a super cheat mod.

We are asking for camapaign battles to actually BE BATTLES not skirmishes that are over before they start. And When it carries over to the next day you lose all your progress due to lower starting points.


But fanbois will be fanbois forceing there style of game play on everyone else.

As multiple people have said. The time limit depends on the whole balance of the game.

Total War Series have long time limits because you cant call reinforcements. So once your guys are dead thats it.
This is not the case with ALB, because more units are called in during a battle.

There is a reason sports game have a time limit. And there is a reason ALB has a time limit, believe it or not.

But the fact still stays the same.

Really dude, just stop a second and think about why its that way. USE YOUR BRAIN
I open the forum for'em. They're waiting for me to chime in
And say what I said Simon, I'm debating if I should sign in.

User avatar
Kraxis
Major-General
Posts: 3909
Joined: Wed 10 Jul 2013 11:56
Contact:

Re: Battle time limit needs adjusting!

Postby Kraxis » Fri 12 Jul 2013 12:18

TheFunnyOne1125 wrote:
crazyewok wrote:BS

Were are not asking for a super cheat mod.

We are asking for camapaign battles to actually BE BATTLES not skirmishes that are over before they start. And When it carries over to the next day you lose all your progress due to lower starting points.


But fanbois will be fanbois forceing there style of game play on everyone else.

As multiple people have said. The time limit depends on the whole balance of the game.

Total War Series have long time limits because you cant call reinforcements. So once your guys are dead thats it.
This is not the case with ALB, because more units are called in during a battle.

There is a reason sports game have a time limit. And there is a reason ALB has a time limit, believe it or not.

But the fact still stays the same.

Really dude, just stop a second and think about why its that way. USE YOUR BRAIN

Then the balance is out of whack honestly.
The main issue with the short battles are that we generally don't have much in terms of forces, so it always ends up being a little scrum of a couple of platoons. That's hardly a battle between brigades. And it holds very little in comparison to the variety offered in EE.
Add more start points? Well then we run into the issue that one engagement and you are most likely out as the starting forces will be considerably bigger than the reinforcements, to the point (if the increase is sufficiently big) that we might just remove the reinforcements alltogether and go for the Total War style. Obviously that isn't an option for Eugen (otherwise they would have done so already).

Increase the points for zones? Massive advantage for the defender, who has 2-5 start zones to pick from (the attacker getting 1), and given the increase is well worth the initial investment to place CVs in.

Longer battles however offer an option to make the battles bigger and more of a fight to get zones (and make it worth the risk). But then we hear that it is a balance issue... WTF? That is all that can really be said about that.
Was it really the intention of Eugen that we have to rush into a meeting engagement and more or less forget about the roles of the battle? That is exactly what is happening because of the time limit, and it is boring and tiring at the same time.
[EUG]MadMat wrote:MadMat says so many things ... :twisted:

crazyewok
Corporal
Posts: 25
Joined: Sun 12 May 2013 04:44
Contact:

Re: Battle time limit needs adjusting!

Postby crazyewok » Fri 12 Jul 2013 13:58

DeuZerre wrote:It's not a super cheat mode! It's playing the way I want it, with the options I wanted. Why didn't the dev put a rocket launcher in the crashed pod at the start? They should have, so the player could chose between all the weapons in the game to play the way he wants this start of the campaign.

Straw man argument.
Last edited by crazyewok on Fri 12 Jul 2013 14:04, edited 1 time in total.

crazyewok
Corporal
Posts: 25
Joined: Sun 12 May 2013 04:44
Contact:

Re: Battle time limit needs adjusting!

Postby crazyewok » Fri 12 Jul 2013 14:01

As multiple people have said. The time limit depends on the whole balance of the game.

Total War Series have long time limits because you cant call reinforcements. So once your guys are dead thats it.
This is not the case with ALB, because more units are called in during a battle.

There is a reason sports game have a time limit. And there is a reason ALB has a time limit, believe it or not.

But the fact still stays the same.

Really dude, just stop a second and think about why its that way. USE YOUR BRAIN[/quote]


Are you people unable to read?

I have no problem WITH A TIME LIMIT it just needs to be better balanced!

It is annoying as hell to spend 10-15 minutes building up a pitifull force and have the game end after 5 minutes before you do anything.

Maybe tbe points need rebalanceing?


But its not working as it is!

Why are people trying to force there game play style on me and others who think the same?


This fanboy lets not change anything attitude is starting to make we want to demand a refund and tell the dozen odd friends who are intrested in this game to not bother with it.

crazyewok
Corporal
Posts: 25
Joined: Sun 12 May 2013 04:44
Contact:

Re: Battle time limit needs adjusting!

Postby crazyewok » Fri 12 Jul 2013 14:03

Kraxis wrote:
TheFunnyOne1125 wrote:As multiple people have said. The time limit depends on the whole balance of the game.

Total War Series have long time limits because you cant call reinforcements. So once your guys are dead thats it.
This is not the case with ALB, because more units are called in during a battle.

There is a reason sports game have a time limit. And there is a reason ALB has a time limit, believe it or not.

But the fact still stays the same.

Really dude, just stop a second and think about why its that way. USE YOUR BRAIN

Then the balance is out of whack honestly.
The main issue with the short battles are that we generally don't have much in terms of forces, so it always ends up being a little scrum of a couple of platoons. That's hardly a battle between brigades. And it holds very little in comparison to the variety offered in EE.
Add more start points? Well then we run into the issue that one engagement and you are most likely out as the starting forces will be considerably bigger than the reinforcements, to the point (if the increase is sufficiently big) that we might just remove the reinforcements alltogether and go for the Total War style. Obviously that isn't an option for Eugen (otherwise they would have done so already).

Increase the points for zones? Massive advantage for the defender, who has 2-5 start zones to pick from (the attacker getting 1), and given the increase is well worth the initial investment to place CVs in.

Longer battles however offer an option to make the battles bigger and more of a fight to get zones (and make it worth the risk). But then we hear that it is a balance issue... WTF? That is all that can really be said about that.
Was it really the intention of Eugen that we have to rush into a meeting engagement and more or less forget about the roles of the battle? That is exactly what is happening because of the time limit, and it is boring and tiring at the same time.


^^^^ Agree 1000000%

User avatar
TheFunnyOne1125
First Sergeant
Posts: 241
Joined: Thu 30 May 2013 15:38
Location: Austin, Texas
Contact:

Re: Battle time limit needs adjusting!

Postby TheFunnyOne1125 » Fri 12 Jul 2013 23:00

Im not a fanboy, and im not saying leave things how they are. But increasing the time limit is not the only solution.

But an increase in a time limit would screw with things. It would make the defender have to be more aggressive.

Like everyone is so fast to say increase the time limit!!!!!

But that is not the only solution. Nobody wants to defend for 40+ minutes, just accumulating all your forces in 1 area.
That sets you up for failure. The attacker would get a massive advantage. All he would have to do is arty the crap out of your force that has been sitting the for 40+ minutes just growing.
And yes I understand its an option. But either way after you picked that option you would have to play all your missions in campaign with that time limit.

People acting like they know everything involved in making a game, or acting like they know how to make a video game. SMH, you don't know what's involved in it. So stop acting like you do.
I open the forum for'em. They're waiting for me to chime in
And say what I said Simon, I'm debating if I should sign in.

User avatar
Kraxis
Major-General
Posts: 3909
Joined: Wed 10 Jul 2013 11:56
Contact:

Re: Battle time limit needs adjusting!

Postby Kraxis » Sat 13 Jul 2013 17:05

TheFunnyOne1125 wrote:Im not a fanboy, and im not saying leave things how they are. But increasing the time limit is not the only solution.

But an increase in a time limit would screw with things. It would make the defender have to be more aggressive.

Like everyone is so fast to say increase the time limit!!!!!

But that is not the only solution. Nobody wants to defend for 40+ minutes, just accumulating all your forces in 1 area.
That sets you up for failure. The attacker would get a massive advantage. All he would have to do is arty the crap out of your force that has been sitting the for 40+ minutes just growing.
And yes I understand its an option. But either way after you picked that option you would have to play all your missions in campaign with that time limit.

People acting like they know everything involved in making a game, or acting like they know how to make a video game. SMH, you don't know what's involved in it. So stop acting like you do.

So the solution is to make the game a battle of platoons? So change the bloody balance so the battles can be longer. I have already posted why certain aspects are troublesome. I have not claimed to know any better than Eugen, but I do know that something is wrong, and don't just fall back on more or less "oh well nothing we can do". Of course the battles can be made longer, it just needs other changes.

And why the heck is the defender in trouble in a longer battle? He gains more points by having significantly higher income. Given the size of many maps the defender can make it hard/slow to push him out of any one zone, all the while he increases in force over his opponent who has to make do with either his starter zone or 1 pointers.
You will really have to explain this one to me. Is it because the enemy can concentrate all his forces against one zone while your forces are spread out? That is true, but the defender can concentrate of defensive units and lines, leading to a slowed offensive, meanwhile he gains more points and can respond with mobile forces, wither against the attacker's 'home' or his flank.

In any case, the campaign does not lend itself to people playing as to their roles. The defender needs to be just as aggressive as the attacker. In fact that is one of the issues I have with it right now. If you don't maneuver aggressively as defender you will lose the chance to intercept the enemy before he gets to your CVs. Staying in one zone is a recipie for disaster or worse, a non-battle because the enemy is busy taking zones rather than attacking.

Also as the rules are now, most battles will not last 40 minutes as the point limit is actually rather low. Especially if the incoming campaign changes increases the points allotted to each player. 2-3000 points can be killed with impressive speed if you have more than a few platoons ready to fight.

Please don't act as if the only thing proposed here is a blind increase of the time limit. The time limit is required to make the battles not feel rushed by requirement, but by choice. It is simply no fun to get your initial forces defeated after a long trek across the map, and then have to either accept a draw or come up with all kinds of 'get points fast' schemes to pull a win by killpoints.
[EUG]MadMat wrote:MadMat says so many things ... :twisted:

User avatar
TheFunnyOne1125
First Sergeant
Posts: 241
Joined: Thu 30 May 2013 15:38
Location: Austin, Texas
Contact:

Re: Battle time limit needs adjusting!

Postby TheFunnyOne1125 » Sat 13 Jul 2013 19:48

Initiative and morale bonuses or going to be adjusted in the new campaign update...

Hopefully this initiative balance will give your more points to play with at the beginning of the battle.

As for the rest, I can't say.

The defender wouldn't be in trouble as I said before. He would have the advantage as an A.I.

You say 20 min is not enough for you to be able to attack. But the defender is going to have just as much time to gather his forces. You have trouble attacking in 20 mins against a defensive force that has built up HIS force for 20mins also.

Your attack is just going to be that much harder to execute. The enemy is going to have a huge force now. You had trouble attacking him before. How much trouble do you think your going to have now?

For a player such as yourself, you would be making it worse on both ends. You would now make it harder for yourself to attack. And as a defensive player your not going to be aggressive as a defensive Ai. You will try to gather your defence in 30min. Then the A.i will poop on you with a huge gathered force.

So first we need to wait to see how the campaign update changes things. And then we need to discuss if there needs to be an increase in time limit. Which im sure there still won't need to be.
Last edited by TheFunnyOne1125 on Sat 13 Jul 2013 20:44, edited 1 time in total.
I open the forum for'em. They're waiting for me to chime in
And say what I said Simon, I'm debating if I should sign in.

User avatar
DeuZerre
More than 10 000 messages. Soldier you are the leader of all armies!
Posts: 11125
Joined: Mon 27 Feb 2012 23:17
Location: Universe, Galaxy, Solar System, Earth, Ground, Eurasian Continent, Main Landmass.
Contact:

Re: Battle time limit needs adjusting!

Postby DeuZerre » Sat 13 Jul 2013 20:35

TheFunnyOne1125 wrote:Initiative and morale bonuses or going to be adjusted in the new campaign update...

Hopefully this initiative balance will give your more points to play with at the beginning of the battle.


Bingo.
Damn, if only I had internet with my main computer, I'd be able to play the coop campaign, like the other marshals... :evil:
Last edited by DeuZerre on Sat 13 Jul 2013 21:04, edited 1 time in total.
Image
Marshal honoris causa
FLX wrote:Removing the weaknesses from the divisions leads to all divisions being the same in the long run. We won't proceed like that.

Return to “Wargame : AirLand Battle”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 24 guests