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Re: the balance

Posted: Sat 6 Jul 2013 22:25
by Hartmann
mrl0ve wrote:
Radioshow wrote: :lol: You have got to be kidding.


Nah, don't worry. Won't happen because people like you don't want to be on a equal playing field with pact.. You might lose.



24AP konkurs.

"Micro is too hard, just give me an ATGM that can hardcounter all heavy armour frontally from extreme range"

If you need this to 'even' the field you must be an absolutely atrocious player.

Re: the balance

Posted: Sat 6 Jul 2013 23:03
by Corsair
Hartmann wrote:
mrl0ve wrote:
Radioshow wrote: :lol: You have got to be kidding.


Nah, don't worry. Won't happen because people like you don't want to be on a equal playing field with pact.. You might lose.



24AP konkurs.

"Micro is too hard, just give me an ATGM that can hardcounter all heavy armour frontally from extreme range"

If you need this to 'even' the field you must be an absolutely atrocious player.


Well 24AP is a bit too much, but Konkurs is on par with I-TOW, so +3AP would be nice.

Re: the balance

Posted: Sat 6 Jul 2013 23:06
by Scharnberg
Corsair wrote:
Well 24AP is a bit too much, but Konkurs is on par with I-TOW, so +3AP would be nice.


No Konkurs have much longer range which means you can use less of them to cover a much larger area. As you allready know they cant do much dmg to heavy tanks from the front. Which just means you have to put them in their flank :) Konkurs is quite fair balanced.

Re: the balance

Posted: Sat 6 Jul 2013 23:08
by Corsair
Scharnberg wrote:
Corsair wrote:
Well 24AP is a bit too much, but Konkurs is on par with I-TOW, so +3AP would be nice.


No Konkurs have much longer range which means you can use less of them to cover a much larger area. As you allready know they cant do much dmg to heavy tanks from the front. Which just means you have to put them in their flank :) Konkurs is quite fair balanced.


175m more range is surely "much longer".
And you don't have the availability to flank so often.

Re: the balance

Posted: Sat 6 Jul 2013 23:17
by Scharnberg
175m is quite abit longer since you have to remember the tanks only have a 1925m, 2100m and 2275m range. I find no problem useing them at flanking, just make a fake retreat where you take all your units except your konkurs teams which you hide in the woods, cities or hedges. 2-3 teams should be hiding in front of your enemy and 2-3 teams on either of their flanks. This means after you "retreat" your Enemys units will at some point then attack and get captured in your trap. (i normaly have their ATGMS turned off untill they are a little bit inside the trap).

Since they are very small and have good stealth even the best recons have a hard time seeing them. If the flanks wood/city/hedge aint that far from the enemy then you can just use the Faktoriya´s as they do pretty good dmg to side armor and have very good stealth.

(im not sure if you can hide them well enough in a hedge, i dont remember right now).

Edit: had for some reason written others instead of enemy in the text

Edit: fixed alot of bad english xD

Re: the balance

Posted: Sat 6 Jul 2013 23:33
by Hartmann
Konkurs combination of strength, accuracy, range and consequent affordability and availability of those units that carry them makes them one of the best ATGMs tbh. They devastate any armour that is not top tier, and the ability to chip away at high end for support is extremely valuable. Their range and their accuracy comes in good use here, and particularly BRDMs are amazing at kiting tanks.

Anyone expecting ATGMs in general to reliably deal with heavies in quantity is playing the wrong game.

Re: the balance

Posted: Sat 6 Jul 2013 23:35
by mrl0ve
Hartmann wrote:

24AP konkurs.

"Micro is too hard, just give me an ATGM that can hardcounter all heavy armour frontally from extreme range"

If you need this to 'even' the field you must be an absolutely atrocious player.


You mean like NATO ?

Re: the balance

Posted: Sat 6 Jul 2013 23:36
by mrl0ve
Hartmann wrote:Anyone expecting ATGMs in general to reliably deal with heavies in quantity is playing the wrong game.


No that one is just playing NATO.

Re: the balance

Posted: Sat 6 Jul 2013 23:57
by Hartmann
I play French national deck as Nato, so I use F2s and HOTs. F2s don't come on any vehicle, making them pretty redundant in the current meta. No good player relies heavily on foot AT teams. You want wheels under your ATGMs. I'm coming to a point where I'm considering removing the F2s from my deck, they're just not useful in the current meta. Too vulnerable to artillery, especially due to them having only 2 health. Konkurs foot teams it's pretty much the same thing, except it takes much longer for artillery to root them out of buildings. This is a huge advantage in the artillery centric meta right now if you do insist on using foot AT. But neither units are particularly amazing atm.

HOTs have power but the 1 less accuracy is pretty huge, I find them unreliable unless you go with really high vet. At which point the availability becomes painful. Using both HOT and Konkurs extensively atm, Konkurs have a noticeably higher hit ratio.

I don't know what player actually consistenty loses heavy tanks to ATGMs from NATO, but if that's a problem for you then you need to rethink your playstyle. ATGM cars don't have remotely the utility against Pact tanks as they do the other way around, they simply get countersniped even if they manage to hit their first shot.

Post some replays though, I'd love to see you play high ranked players and proving me wrong. What team do you play with? For some replays of my play just check the replay repository for those tagged with EPIC. If you want more I can throw some at you.

http://alb-replays.info/#/browse/?searc ... ked=0&ai=0

Re: the balance

Posted: Sun 7 Jul 2013 00:03
by Corsair
Hartmann wrote:I play French national deck as Nato, so I use F2s and HOTs. F2s don't come on any vehicle, making them pretty redundant in the current meta. No good player relies heavily on foot AT teams. You want wheels under your ATGMs. I'm coming to a point where I'm considering removing the F2s from my deck, they're just not useful in the current meta. Too vulnerable to artillery, especially due to them having only 2 health. Konkurs foot teams it's pretty much the same thing, except it takes much longer for artillery to root them out of buildings. This is a huge advantage in the artillery centric meta right now if you do insist on using foot AT. But neither units are particularly amazing atm.


Exactly the same or worse for wheeled ATGM, and also very easily spotted. Well, that's my feeling..