Transport helicopters

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Bullfrog
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Transport helicopters

Postby Bullfrog » Tue 21 May 2013 07:08

Generally in any deck I make, I leave 2 or 3 inf units for QRF based missions.

spec ops
AA
Recon inf as optional.

I use blackhawks or Ch47s to transport them to the place they hold until I can get their attention else where or reinforce them.

A issue with this is that sometimes landing a helicopter can take over 3 min. Even then you may have to split squad and make him take off and re-land just to get the troops down.

This seems a bit silly IMO. Air transport should have two options of unloading.
One being to land and unload, a slow process but safe.
the other should be fast rope. A fast process but at a greater risk of taking AA fire.

The idea is hitting unload by it self would just stop the heli and they would fast rope out, to get them to land on the ground and unload, you have to hit 'land' then 'unload' much like you do with resupply heli.

at the very least, fix the bug where a heli pilot gets completely out played by a effing fence post.

And I do think Heli should start flying, it's cheep that some people can get an advantage based on the geographic area of their starting zone, not all zones have trees where they can exploit and get a fast head start.
Last edited by Bullfrog on Tue 21 May 2013 08:00, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Quick Re-action force

Postby grimreffer2 » Tue 21 May 2013 07:15

Fast roping wasn't invented during this time frame. Also, fast roping wasn't really fast, it took more time to unload troops then Land and Unload. The average unload speed of a huey in Real life was like 5 seconds.(Swoop in, unload, swoop out 5-10seconds total) Average Unload speed for a chinook is like 1-2mins. You have to land it in order to unload, unlike Hueys and blackhawks.

This is what I think should happen,

Huey's-Have the least amount of armor/firepower. Lowest speed. Fastest unload speed.

Blackhawk- Have average Armor, good fire power, fastest speed, average unload speed.

Chinooks- Great armor, average fire power, average speed, slowest unload speed.
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Re: Quick Re-action force

Postby Bullfrog » Tue 21 May 2013 07:21

grimreffer2 wrote:Fast roping wasn't invented during this time frame. Also, fast roping wasn't really fast, it took more time to unload troops then Land and Unload. The average unload speed of a huey in Real life was like 5 seconds.(Swoop in, unload, swoop out 5-10seconds total) Average Unload speed for a chinook is like 1-2mins. You have to land it in order to unload, unlike Hueys and blackhawks.

This is what I think should happen,

Huey's-Have the least amount of armor/firepower. Lowest speed. Fastest unload speed.

Blackhawk- Have average Armor, good fire power, fastest speed, average unload speed.

Chinooks- Great armor, average fire power, average speed, slowest unload speed.


Fast roping, if not fast it does give more capabilities for landing in the woods/towns and it is faster for the heli to get in to position.

I can't believe it wasn't 'invented' in the 80s though.. it seems like a really simple thing. but if that's the case, then SMIB.

They should really fix the landing and taking off issues though. It's beyond stupid that you can go the same speed with a humvee or maybe even a 113 as a heli cause it takes so much time landing and taking off.
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Re: Quick Re-action force

Postby Bullfrog » Tue 21 May 2013 07:23

just looked it up, 1st use was the falkland wars by the brits in 82
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Re: Quick Re-action force

Postby grimreffer2 » Tue 21 May 2013 07:31

Agreed, the Helo Landing needs to be adjusted. Right now as it stands, Helo transports are good for sneaking around the enemy on the outskirts of the map. Other then that, a Humvee can reach the same place and unload faster then any other chopper.

http://www.reocities.com/fgrivel/images/bfv/huey.jpg <Correct Way> http://usmilitaryhelicopters.org/sites/ ... ietnam.jpg


<Incorrect way> http://www.northtexas.va.gov/images/fea ... eature.jpg (Landing and shutting off engines. Taking around 1min)
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Re: Transport helicopters

Postby cphoenix » Tue 21 May 2013 08:05

The problem isn't that fast roping isn't in the time frame, it's that it'd push era decks out of usefulness because infantry that could do it would need to be tagged with years later than 1980. So either you have a lot of pretty much duplicate infantry for the sake of one feature, or you screw over era decks and their access to infantry. It's not a friendly problem and probably far too much of a headache for so little benefit.
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Re: Transport helicopters

Postby Bullfrog » Tue 21 May 2013 08:16

cphoenix wrote:The problem isn't that fast roping isn't in the time frame, it's that it'd push era decks out of usefulness because infantry that could do it would need to be tagged with years later than 1980. So either you have a lot of pretty much duplicate infantry for the sake of one feature, or you screw over era decks and their access to infantry. It's not a friendly problem and probably far too much of a headache for so little benefit.



I disagree about era decks being push out of usefulness. Just because a deck consist of unit's pre 1980 doesn't mean training changes.

The war is fought in the 80s and changing the deck era doesn't change that.
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Re: Transport helicopters

Postby Tressa » Tue 21 May 2013 08:36

I don't think it's an realism issue as more an actual game-bug.

A lot of the time when 2 helicopters are grouped one (or both) have issues dropping their troops. What usually happens is one heli lands, the other hovers around aimlessly, tries to land, for some reason takes off again and tries to land a few millimeters away again, dragging the entire process out endlessly.

If whatever causes that is fixed, I think unboarding times are fine within the game.
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Re: Transport helicopters

Postby grimreffer2 » Tue 21 May 2013 08:52

Tressa wrote:I don't think it's an realism issue as more an actual game-bug.


It's not a bug, it's unrealistic. I use a cavalry deck all the time, and for 1 chopper to land(Mind you not a group) it takes around 15 seconds. Mid stop where land spot is, then slower lowers itself, then hovers over the ground for like 5 seconds, then lands turns off it's engines and finally releases the troops. Then to get back out takes another 15 seconds, Start up engines, get to alt, then fly away. Most of the time you can't even land in a hot area, because it takes to damn long to land. Helo's were meant to transport troops into the heat of battle quickly and take them out if necessary.
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Re: Transport helicopters

Postby Bullfrog » Tue 21 May 2013 10:21

grimreffer2 wrote:
Tressa wrote:I don't think it's an realism issue as more an actual game-bug.


It's not a bug, it's unrealistic. I use a cavalry deck all the time, and for 1 chopper to land(Mind you not a group) it takes around 15 seconds. Mid stop where land spot is, then slower lowers itself, then hovers over the ground for like 5 seconds, then lands turns off it's engines and finally releases the troops. Then to get back out takes another 15 seconds, Start up engines, get to alt, then fly away. Most of the time you can't even land in a hot area, because it takes to damn long to land. Helo's were meant to transport troops into the heat of battle quickly and take them out if necessary.


It can be both, a bug and unrealistic. But you are right, it takes for ever for the ai to figure out to land, I think it would be easier on the ai if it could just stop to a hover and let off the troops by fast rope. It doesn't have to analyze the contours, trees, buildings and mountains of the map just to let out troops. Then it has to go threw an entire check list of slow down to a stop, change alt, land, engine off, unload. Taking off takes to long too.

If they can't do fast rope at least a dust off style unload where it comes in lands takes off and re-gain alt. With a more fluid landing.

One of the issues I have with heli is selecting them or the inf that's being drop off, it's always in the way. Unload should be.. move to, change alt while moving, land, unload, take off. or Move to, stop, unload threw fast rope, fly off.

It really does feel like landing is to much work for AI and fast rope would be an easy way to make up for that.
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