Fine-tuning NK/China

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Razzmann
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Re: Fine-tuning NK/China

Postby Razzmann » Mon 10 Oct 2016 01:04

codextero wrote:- something re-roled into a good optics fighting recon

The Z-9A would fit into that.
Unless you mean ground recon, but the low end ZTQs already fill that role and they are quite good at it thanks to the RoF buff.

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Re: Fine-tuning NK/China

Postby frostypooky » Mon 10 Oct 2016 01:14

and don't forget naming changes for proper units, spelling. and consistency with WRD romanization :)

Yuckjeondae-> Ryukjeondae (former is romanization of S.Korean spelling)
Jeogockdae -> Jeogyokdae
Gongbobyong-> Gyongbobyong
Juckwidae-> Jeokwidae

swap Ryukjeondae name (short of Hanggong-ryukjeondae, 'air assault') with Gyongbobyong ('light infantry', NK's nomenclature for independent SOF brigades--conflicts with academic/game terms but it is what it is) so the Shock air light inf is Ryukjeondae and Elite SOF is Gyongbobyong

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Re: Fine-tuning NK/China

Postby QUAD » Mon 10 Oct 2016 06:16

+1000
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Re: Fine-tuning NK/China

Postby Grabbed_by_the_Spets » Mon 10 Oct 2016 07:42

frostypooky wrote:and don't forget naming changes for proper units, spelling. and consistency with WRD romanization :)

Yuckjeondae-> Ryukjeondae (former is romanization of S.Korean spelling)
Jeogockdae -> Jeogyokdae
Gongbobyong-> Gyongbobyong
Juckwidae-> Jeokwidae

swap Ryukjeondae name (short of Hanggong-ryukjeondae, 'air assault') with Gyongbobyong ('light infantry', NK's nomenclature for independent SOF brigades--conflicts with academic/game terms but it is what it is) so the Shock air light inf is Ryukjeondae and Elite SOF is Gyongbobyong


Either way, I'm not going to be able to pronounce those! :P
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Re: Fine-tuning NK/China

Postby Sgt._Pepper » Mon 10 Oct 2016 11:42

What is the chance that Eugen is going to add and reroll units?
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HrcAk47
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Re: Fine-tuning NK/China

Postby HrcAk47 » Mon 10 Oct 2016 13:33

frostypooky wrote:and don't forget naming changes for proper units, spelling. and consistency with WRD romanization :)

Yuckjeondae-> Ryukjeondae (former is romanization of S.Korean spelling)
Jeogockdae -> Jeogyokdae
Gongbobyong-> Gyongbobyong
Juckwidae-> Jeokwidae

swap Ryukjeondae name (short of Hanggong-ryukjeondae, 'air assault') with Gyongbobyong ('light infantry', NK's nomenclature for independent SOF brigades--conflicts with academic/game terms but it is what it is) so the Shock air light inf is Ryukjeondae and Elite SOF is Gyongbobyong


This should be added into the official suggestion list. It is important to have names correct and authentic.
The SEAD never bothered me anyway.

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Re: Fine-tuning NK/China

Postby keldon » Mon 10 Oct 2016 15:45

Xeno426 wrote:Well, you could note that EVERY SINGLE J-7 is using the wrong gun. Except the J-7C/D.


Got it, will add it to inconsistencies.

Demonicjapsel wrote:That leaves one thing though, shouldn't we reconsider re rolling one of the A/Q-5 clusterbombers into a cheap iron bomber?


The NK A-5 is listed for rerole into a 4x500kg HE bomb truck. It will certainly help NK national deck with an affordable iron bomber.

codextero wrote:I support all of it except the Jeogockdae sniper rifles, it's a nerf to them since 15 man squads want to be in the thick of the fighting, and sniper rifles suck in those situations. I would prefer the RPD recieve a slight buff and they stay as is. Something else can be done to Yuckjeondae to make them different. Also, no model changes on infantry.

Two things I would like to see

- HQ-6 and Pongae 2 in Mech/Armored. China and NK both do not have any tracked AA with more range than a SPAAG, which causes those deck specs to get brutalized by air. HQ-7 would be nice as well but that's a stretch.

- something re-roled into a good optics fighting recon


Give the marines a sniper is one way to make them eligible to be dropped down to 25 pts. I took consideration to make them not conflict with NK SF and Morskaya in SovKor. Frankly if they are armed with mg and can just coming down 5 pts i would be total fine with it.

On topic about wheeled AA in mech/armor decks: well we tried many times so i'm offering different approaches, like a ASF or just add the HQ-17, technically it doesn't need a new model, heck you don't even need to change the texture, cause freshly bought from Russian inventory or so.

frostypooky wrote:and don't forget naming changes for proper units, spelling. and consistency with WRD romanization :)

Yuckjeondae-> Ryukjeondae (former is romanization of S.Korean spelling)
Jeogockdae -> Jeogyokdae
Gongbobyong-> Gyongbobyong
Juckwidae-> Jeokwidae

swap Ryukjeondae name (short of Hanggong-ryukjeondae, 'air assault') with Gyongbobyong ('light infantry', NK's nomenclature for independent SOF brigades--conflicts with academic/game terms but it is what it is) so the Shock air light inf is Ryukjeondae and Elite SOF is Gyongbobyong


thx for these names, i will put a relink to your post under inconsistencies, since i believe while this is important for authenticity it doesn't affect playability much.
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Re: Fine-tuning NK/China

Postby remilia019 » Mon 10 Oct 2016 16:57

I'd say ZTZ-85-IIA doesn't necessitate the 8rpm anymore that is demanded on top priority, its roughly equal with the Chieftain mk. 11 at the moment. Unless of course, we get the swap on secondary priority on ZTZ-85-IIA to ZTZ-85-IIM, I personally didn't like the change on the secondary as Red Dragons struck to me currently due to it disabling me from being able to have a decent medium tank when I use only China rather than Red Dragons. (Perhaps ZTZ-85-IIM should be intro'd as new unit? or ZTZ-90-II?)

If Zhanshi '85 were to get both Type 81 and Type 69-III it kind of struck to me as slightly OP as in comparison to the Motostrelki '90, I'd support Type 69-III only.

Without JH-7 having AGM, I think we should get a new AGM plane, these are crucial in most if not all decks, I can't find myself trusting either the Su-25 or the MiG-21Bis.

Other stuff look pretty great to me, I sort of giggled with Su-27SMK being akin to a Red F-16Block 52. I personally prefer if we can split them, or have an alternative for 140pts, like say, a J-8 with R-77?

Xeno426 wrote:I want more changes to the air tab, but that's just me. :P
A few aircraft could have a bump in their ECM, though.


Same here, especially with JH-7 :D
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Re: Fine-tuning NK/China

Postby keldon » Mon 10 Oct 2016 17:15

remilia019 wrote:I'd say ZTZ-85-IIA doesn't necessitate the 8rpm anymore that is demanded on top priority, its roughly equal with the Chieftain mk. 11 at the moment. Unless of course, we get the swap on secondary priority on ZTZ-85-IIA to ZTZ-85-IIM, I personally didn't like the change on the secondary as Red Dragons struck to me currently due to it disabling me from being able to have a decent medium tank when I use only China rather than Red Dragons. (Perhaps ZTZ-85-IIM should be intro'd as new unit? or ZTZ-90-II?)

If Zhanshi '85 were to get both Type 81 and Type 69-III it kind of struck to me as slightly OP as in comparison to the Motostrelki '90, I'd support Type 69-III only.

Without JH-7 having AGM, I think we should get a new AGM plane, these are crucial in most if not all decks, I can't find myself trusting either the Su-25 or the MiG-21Bis.

Other stuff look pretty great to me, I sort of giggled with Su-27SMK being akin to a Red F-16Block 52. I personally prefer if we can split them, or have an alternative for 140pts, like say, a J-8 with R-77?


8 rpm helps 85-III too, and RD is anemic in higher rpm for their tanks. Also the coalition balance is taken over the national balance, technically China national would still have a decent 65 pts tank.

I used Fusilier as the standard to compare when doing the line infantry suggestion. Honestly modern RD line troop needs to go up in capability.

You can simulate 24x250kg cluster by using 2 F-16 block 5, try it out yourself, the kill potential is extrem, and it is less effected by RNG compared to ATGM. On a coalition level the Su-25K is really decent tank buster, it only needs to get 2 rear armor and maybe 20% ecm to shine even brighter.

btw. I did some thought collection about the BD thread and i only came up with few issues, that would be:

- poor infantry based AP
- K1A1 is awkwardly positioned due to pricing and capability
- ASF is lacking a bit
- plane AT severly lacking
- some inconsistencies when fixed would be nice passive buffs.

I will do a thread tommorow if nobody else wants to take over.
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> Sources for tuning Red Dragons --- Sources for tuning Blue Dragons <
亲们!大国梦哦!
小钱钱,真心甜,鼓钱包,放腰间,大国梦,早日圆 。啷个哩个啷♪

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Re: Fine-tuning NK/China

Postby Bougnas » Mon 10 Oct 2016 18:25

Great post, but I would add some things:

- if the ZTZ-59-IIA stays at CAT A and if you want to buff it, I think that you could buff the speed to 55kph (new 730HP engine, also available on the similar ZTZ-79, and buff accuracy stats to 65/50% (late ZTZ-85-IIA received the same ISFCS-212 FCS as the ZTZ-85s and the ZTZ-88). It would really turn it into a great vehicle.

- for the same FCS reason, the ZTZ-85-II could get an accuracy buff.
I think that it would be more logical than just +5% for all post 80's tanks.

- another possible reroll would be to turn the unrealistic MD-500 S-5 into the realistic Mi-2 gunship (NS-23 gun, 32 S-5 rockets, 4 Susong Po), already available ingame as a Polish variant (the URN?). Can be available as recon chopper as well. It's not much, but still way better than the old one.
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